Channel: Mythical Kitchen
YouTube Video ID: XrIdECo9YSA
Episode Post Date: February 10, 2026
Transcript
I'm Dr. Mike Harshovski and this is my last meal. Every person has exactly two things in common. We all got to eat and we're all going to die. Today's guest is a board-certified family medicine doctor and professional boxer who just so happens to have 30 million followers across social media. He's a UNICEF ambassador and founder of the Limitless Tomorrow Foundation. He's also the reason I got this cute little purple star on my face. Dr. Mike Barowski, welcome to the show. Wait, tell me about the purple star. >> This speaks to your impact on my life because 2 days ago I had scheduled my first ever uh full skin check for skin cancer. >> Oo, we were really busy in the studio and I was like, it's an hour away. I'm going to cancel it. I made up all the excuses and I thought, what would Dr. Mike do? I swear to God. And then I'm sitting in the dermatologist's office and they go, hey, you have this one mole here that is slightly different than your signature mole color, which I also learned is a thing. >> And they said they want to do a biopsy. And I was like, you know, I have to be on camera in two days. Uh, is it going to, you know, show? They said, "Well, yeah, we can't take something off your skin without it showing." And Dr. Mike would tell me to get the preventative care that I need. And so now I have >> So they give you a shave biopsy. >> No, no. They asked if uh they they wanted me to shave my entire body, and I said, "No." >> Oh, no. >> What's a shave biopsy? >> I thought you were going to prefer wax. A shave biopsy is basically like a superficial way that they take out, and I say they, we take out um a piece of an atypical mole. My strategy in a medical setting has been to not ask any questions at all and just close my eyes. >> You know, I've seen patients that have different takes on that. Sure. >> Uh normally I want to tell everyone what's happening so that they feel at ease cuz my assumption is that the more you know, the more comfortable you are, especially if I'm performing a procedure on the back. >> And I remember I was this is great to talk about before food, but I was cutting out an abscess. Go ahead. >> On someone's back and as I was cutting out, I was explaining everything. I'm putting on my gloves. You're going to feel my fingers. you're going to feel this. And the patient said, "Stop telling me this." And he had to catch me multiple times cuz my reflex is to give patients information. But you're right. Some people just prefer to let the doctor take control. >> Dr. Mike, thanks so much for joining me today, man. >> I'm very excited. >> Of course. Have you thought about your last meal before? >> I have not thought about my last meal, but I have thought about a lot of meals and lately have been thinking about them more. M and that's because just like a traditional hypocrite that is a doctor, my cholesterol is not great and I need to control it, but some of the food is so good. It's so good. >> We made food taste too good and now >> we made food taste so good. We have all the options. We massage our cows. It's actually gotten out of control. >> It really has. But hey, one last ride before, you know, get on the statins or reduce the >> We need to we need to preface what's happening here is not an endorsement to eat these foods all the time. At the same time, we don't want to villainize these foods because in moderation, if you don't have medical conditions, perhaps it's okay. >> And then sometimes you host a show where you do like 50 of these a year and you do it all the time. You tell yourself you sweat it out in the gym and you smell like beef. Uh how often do you think about death in general? >> You know, personally, I don't think about it much, but I do think about it for my patients quite often because uh I try and approach uh every patient encounter with longevity in my mindset. And you know, there's like this whole new spree of longevity doctors popping up. >> Oh, I've seen it. >> And it gets me confused because I think every doctor is a longevity doctor with one exception. Do you know what that is? >> Dr. Kavorian. >> Uh yes. I mean specialty-wise though. >> Wait, wait. This this is a fun riddle. Every doctor's longevity doctor except for >> every single doctor is interested in making you live longer with one exception. >> Is is this a play on longevity in your neurologist? >> No. This is so practical that you're going to say duh as soon as you hear it. >> I don't know it. >> A hospice doctor. >> Because once you're on hospice, that's the doctor saying we're focusing more on comfort. >> Is this what doctors laugh at? Like like would that have killed at a medical conference? >> Maybe. You know, we have some of the darkest humor in healthcare because we're also part of the darkest moments in people's lives. And as you've seen in some medical dramas, you see the nurses, the doctors, the CAMAs, the techs, we're always trying to deal with these dark moments through humor. And what I found quite interesting in taking care of patients for the last decade is that those patients who are sickest, people are most serious around them. And yet they're the ones who need to laugh the most. >> So if you can tastefully, very important to say tastefully, introduce a little bit of humor in there, I think it goes a long way. >> You ready to eat? >> I am very ready to eat. >> Let's do it. >> Dr. Mike, for the first course of your final meal on earth, we have the A5 Wagi ribeye and a sushi omicas >> together. >> Together. >> Wow. >> We should get to the A5 first because, as you know, it's got that intramuscular fat in there. It's hot and ready, ready to eat. We have three sauces right here. We grilled this over Japanese binchan coals in the parking lot. That's what you're smelling on the way in. Please dig in. I'm so sorry. >> Wow. Wow. Wow. Wow. Oh, and you're going with the chopsticks for it. >> I mean, you said Wagyu, man. This is chopstick. >> Okay. All right. So, we're going chopstick. It looks beautiful. >> I know. >> And I wish I could be as good of a human as Neil deGrasse Tyson when he was a guest where he's like, "We're saving the animals." And I'm just like, >> "Nope." >> Th this animal did live a great life, right? They listen to music. >> Yeah. >> They they get massage. >> So yeah, not to put a damper on your last meal, but it is a little bit overstated how they treat you're thinking of like traditional protected coobe prefixure beef. >> And that's not what the term Wagyu just kind of means Japanese cow in Japan. This is from the Kagoshima Prefecture. Olive. So a much better life than most cows. >> Olive. >> I cannot vouch for the fact that they were listening to Sound Garden before they passed. >> I already feel my cholesterol going up. >> Mhm. Mike, if you have a medical emergency, who treats you? Just crowdsource it on on Instagram. I >> think we've watched enough of your videos. >> We can do another one of those videos where it's like Instagram decides how we saved on. >> Why A5 Waggy on the last meal? What does it mean to you? >> Whenever we celebrate something as a family, we somehow always end up at a steakhouse. >> Mhm. >> And New York has a lot of great steakous. probably the nicest one that I had growing up as an immigrant. We got invited to an event at Peter Luggers. >> And Peter Luger, when you live in Brooklyn, that's the holy thing where you get a steak and they actually don't have uh at least when I went uh wag you there. >> But they had an amazing porter house >> and ever since I tasted that Peter Luggers, I was like, every time we're celebrating any kind of milestone, we're getting top tier steak. Y that's the goal. Does this make you feel better knowing that this is now considered the healthiest food in America given the new food pyramid? >> Oh yeah, it is. Right. It's right at the top. And then right at the bottom of the least healthy foods is oats. You know what doesn't make sense to me about that? >> What's that? >> The current administration has been very vocal about the food pyramid. But the food pyramid hasn't been used by any agency, by any physician in decades. >> I think since 2012. And even then it was the adjusted pyramid with with the dude sprinting up it. >> Yes. Mhm. >> Cuz then we went to healthy plate afterwards. We did a whole video on this in like 2017. >> So why we're attacking like that's like me saying I'm remaking the nutrition guidelines from the 1950s >> when smoking was recommended by doctors as a stress reliever. So >> Mike said smoking is a good stress reliever. Let's do it. >> Wow, that's so good. How do you feel about this? I I think it's fantastic as a once in a while treat, but I think like eating a huge Wagyu steak all the time or >> celebratory only. >> 100%. And that's what keeps it special. If you had it every single day, it wouldn't be special. >> It's also very pricey. >> So, it's nice when you go, you could actually get maybe one or two ounces only. >> Yeah. >> Just as a little a little like some people like a sweet treat. I like this. >> Yeah. This is a meat treat. Meat treat. You like a sweet treat? You like a meat treat? >> Meat treat. Okay. >> Can I have another one of these? >> Please. Please eat eat to your fill. This is your last meal. We do have a five course omic ac. >> Oh my god. Okay, I'm just going to save this. >> Please eat. I'll explain. Dr. Mike, we have sushi chef Colby back here now. We have designed a five course omicass. >> You did Kobe and Colby? >> Yeah, I know. We just hired him for the day only because of that. But we have a five course that is actually telling the story of your life. >> No, >> we do. So for the first course, what we have, we are simply calling this the Russian. So this is this is Mike. You were born in the U technically the USSR and you moved here when you were five. So what we've done is we have cured horse mackerel with the flavors of a kilbasa sausage >> and then we've actually topped it with a brunois of pickled beets and some crispy potato. >> You made a borch sushi piece >> effectively. Yeah. I'm curious though when you moved to America you're obviously super young but do you have like a very strong conscious memory of anything from your time in Russia? I remember one story because I think it scarred me significantly and that one story goes as such. My dad went and bought some kind of sweets from the local market and he got the last ones and then all these older kids in the little playground where we played wanted it. So I started selling it to them but I only had a few to sell. >> So then I said, "Hey guys, I have pairs." So, I started to create a business that day selling pairs on the playground. >> You're like 5 years old at this time. >> Yeah. Full five years old. Marking up these pairs 300%. Only to have my dad find this out. Absolutely. Tear into me and yell at me that I'm scheming my friends, that I should never do this to my friends, and made me walk around to each of their respective apartments and give their money back. Why? That story sticks in my head. Go figure. But that's also a microcosm of what was happening during the Paris Troka era in Russia. You were part of the problem. Exactly. As a child, >> we we were gathering resources. We were trying to maximize profits. And that is not what you're supposed to do. And my dad taught me that lesson. >> What a lesson to learn from a young age. Uh hey, cheers. >> Okay. So, cheers. The presentation's amazing. Cheers, sir. >> Thank you, Colby. M. The pickled effect is nice. >> Mhm. It kind of tastes like sausage, too. There's a little bit of cold smoke on there. Mhm. We just need like a a Russian bath house and >> the picture's complete where they beat you with the uh with the branches. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Is there any >> Have you been? >> I've never been. I would love to go. >> Highly recommend. >> What are you doing tonight? It's a Friday night. >> We should go. >> Friday night at the bath house. >> Um you were going to say is there any medical benefit to getting smacked? >> Maybe. >> I mean, maybe emotionally. And uh it does help with skin circulation cuz you do get quite pink when you get hit over and over again. So I'm sure there's something to do with that. >> Um for the second piece of your omicas, we are calling this >> this is the healer. So we have you are represented by the eggs. So we have parent with child. Your father was a doctor and when you were in high school, you got uh the early nickname of Dr. Mike. >> Yes. >> Because you would give your friends medical advice. Yeah. Was >> totally unethical. >> I was going to ask if there were any like terrible repercussions that happened from you giving bad medical advice as a team. >> Honestly, no. cuz the advice was always super generic and awful. It was a it was entrylevel chat GBT answers. So someone would say, "Hey, I I pulled a muscle motin." I probably should have asked some questions before prescribing the Motrin. And I say prescribing loosely. So yeah, no, not nothing dangerous, but enough to the point that it became a habit and a pattern where I said, "Oh, I could see the future where I actually am a doctor." >> Hey, the nickname stuck. Also underneath we have what's called lomi lomi salmon which is Hawaiian for massage salmon as a nod to the um the manual joint manipulation of osteopathy. >> OM let's go. Okay. Love to see it. This is taking me to Brooklyn 1995. Mhm. First day in America. Sitting in my grandparents apartment in really terrible clothes and just celebrating that we all made it to America. And this is what we would eat. Like the flavor >> Yeah. brings back the memory. It's almost like how scent is very tied to memory >> 100% >> is taste as much because I don't know much about that. I know you're a foodie. So >> there's actually you referenced the Neil Degrass Dyson episode. We talked about this study from I believe his name was Pierre Brocher in 2001 that kind of proved that humans have no independent olfactory sense that you can separate from the other senses. As in humans are really terrible at identifying smell when every other sense is shut off. So, like your taste and your smell are so closely intertwined that they ultimately just kind of mesh into the same sensory experience. >> Ah, okay. >> Yeah. >> And in that episode you said that you should breathe with your meals. >> Mhm. >> Which most of the time I just inhale. >> Yeah, that's a fair point. Yeah. It kind of sometimes it's funner if it goes down faster. >> Yeah. Well, I don't know if it's again the immigrant background, but every time there's food in front of me, it's like full vacuum cleaner mode. So, >> yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Not not medically advisable. >> Yeah. No, because then you're going to be swallowing more air. And when you swallow more air, you're going to be belching, maybe discomfort. So, I wouldn't advise. >> All right, for the third piece of your omicas, >> this one should be obvious. Uh, this one's just called the fighter. This is a simple yellow tail with a little bit of a red maguro on top. That's flying fish row to represent the red boxing gloves. >> But you took up boxing after your mom passed away from cancer. And you said that boxing chose you. I'm curious what specifically about boxing you couldn't get from any other type of physical activity or challenge. >> Yeah. So, when I was in medical school, um we found out that my mom had cancer and it was obviously tough to hear that, but my dad being so optimistic made me feel like nothing bad was going to happen. He was just so confident that we'd get over this. >> Also, the type of cancer that she had, CLL, is one that people grow older with, meaning that they don't immediately get sick from it and die. So, I had a lot of optimism. I started first year of my medical school, which was actually year four because I was in a seven-year combined program. Yeah. >> And sadly, right at the beginning of that year at finals for that uh half of the year in December, she passed away. And when she passed away, even though my school was in Long Island, I moved back in with my dad in Staten Island. And we slept in the same bed for a while. We needed to support each other. Um, I didn't want to go out. I didn't want to do anything. I was just like, "School, my dad, school, my dad." We ended up getting an amazing dog, Roxy, together during that time to try and have some positivity. God, this is turning in so sad because Roxy also just died a couple months ago. >> I mean, that's that's life though, right? It's >> And this is the last meal, so we're confronting mortality. Yeah. I wasn't taking care of myself. And I said, "I need to get out of the house. I need to practice what I would inevitably preach as a physician to my patients. You got to have action before you get motivation. And what I did was I went on Groupon and found a pass for a box. >> It says action like Groupon. >> Yeah, exactly. I mean, the immigrant lifestyle still stuck together. So, >> I found the Groupon and I said, I'm going to go. Super uncomfortable, but I'm going to do it. And I fell in love with it. It allowed me to redirect some of that negative energy. Um, and I stuck with it for a long period of time, more as a fitness thing. And then when all these influencers started boxing, I'm like, "Oh, this is fun. Let's do this. Raise some money for charity. Maybe dissuade people from doing it professionally because we don't recommend people get punched in the face in the medical field." >> I'll agree to disagree on that. Medical practitioners, Mike, I think it's pretty good. >> And now we get to celebrate by eating uh a little fishy in the ring. >> Please eat. >> Oh my god. Okay. This is going to be a knockout. I can tell. >> You still got it, folks. Do you prefer sushi or sashimi? >> I actually have a very deep abiding love for like the crazy rolls like the crazy maki because I grew up in Southern California. >> Okay. >> Where a lot of the sushi bars are actually owned by Korean families. >> In Korean food, they have something called kimbop where for them they roll it in rice and seaweed, but they'll put scrambled eggs and chicken and ham and kimchi. For them, it's like a very work meal. >> And so they're, you know, Korean families are already used to adding a ton of stuff in these rice rolls. And so they kind of brought that to the sushi tradition. >> Wow. So I love like a really well done like shrimp tempura, crab salad, spicy tuna, eel sauce. I love a traditional like edeto style sushi as well. But >> so you didn't go right away to Nou level sushi. >> No. All right, go for course number four. We're calling this I forgot to inform you. This is the sex pot. >> Oh, >> Dr. Mike, many people know that you were named People magazine's 2015 sexiest doctor of the year, but I don't know how many people are intimately familiar with the Buzzfeed article. Um, you got to see this hot doctor and his dog is what it's literally titled. And in that article, they say, "He might just be the best doggy dad around. Look at the flawless spooning technique during this session." >> Oh my god, that's >> Can you analyze your own spooning technique and tell me if it's flawless? >> You ready for a spoiler? >> Yes, please. This is I I selfie this picture >> of >> you don't think early influencer days were hella cringe. This is this was a selfie. How do you What mindset does an individual need to be in? >> It was your mindset, man. >> That was a lonely time, man. This is uh If you think I'm the sole influencer that faked a picture like this, I have news for you. >> The sushi. This is our This is our sexiest sushi we can think of. This is a spicy crab salad with a little bit of serrano, some cured lemon, and then uh gold leaf on top. >> Wow. Cold leaf. Cheers. >> Cheers. >> Money salad. >> Yeah. Yeah. This is real dungeonous crab though. That was handpicked by Colby. Hey, Colby. I just want to say thanks so much, man. >> Yeah. Also, are you doing okay back there? >> Yeah, I'm good. You enjoying your last ever? >> Is that a threat? >> I'm going to see you in the parking lot afterwards. Just don't make eye contact or do make eye contact. He's like, "You think I'm paying that copay?" >> All right, for the last course of your final >> Omaz on Earth until Kobe shanks you in the parking lot. >> We're calling this one the Ferrari. >> Oo. >> So, we got >> the bright red AI brushed with some Italian Calabrian chili oil, a little bit of Castle Vrono chopped up on there with some lemon zest. >> You know the weight of my heart, sir. >> Cheers. >> Cheers. You bought your dad when he retired a 2024 Ferrari Roma. When you look back at all the time sitting at the New York Auto Show, dreaming about one day being able to afford a Buick Saber but thinking it was out of reach. >> Yeah. >> Was that Ferrari gift tying the bow on the American dream for him? >> Absolutely. I felt it. He's usually one to get angry at things like that and he gave in right away because it it truly was a culmination of a lot of things coming together and at the same time falling apart but overcoming those pitfalls and uh I very vividly remember in the early in the late '9s going to the Jacob Javitz show as you said and at the time my dad had an Oldsmobile and he wanted a Buick Leaber so bad that at one point I was like you know what once I become a do I'm 7 years old thinking this once I become a doctor. Maybe I could buy my dad a Buick. But then to be able to 25 years later get him a Ferrari, something that we couldn't even get close to because there were velvet ropes around it. >> Yeah. >> For him to be able to sit in it to now become a little bit more social with his friend group because they want to go for rides with him. To be able to give that back to him is there's no better blessing than that, I think. >> Dr. your mic for the second course of your final meal on earth. We have the bilmani. >> Oh, with a little side of smatana. >> Oh, you bring out the Russian. >> Wait, do you have a Russian background? >> So, technically my uh grandma was like Russian Lithuanian Jew, but moved to South Africa in like the late 1800s during the programs. So, like maiden name is Blesovski. Okay. >> So, like they were from Blesov. Y'all must have been from Varav. >> I'm assuming. >> I wonder if we ever ran into each other out there. Uh but no, mostly any Russian that I do know is cuz I I work at a food bank on Sundays and we have a lot of uh Russian people coming in. And so if they're ever asking like what is this yogurt or sour cream or whatever that we have, I just say >> and they go sitana >> cuz it's just a kind of blanket term for coagulated cream, right? >> Well, dig in. So these are ve feel panny uh with a little bit of actually vinegar and butter sauteed in the sauce here. >> Okay, so this is a high level. We My dad would just boil them for me. M this is I'm eating childhood right now. >> This last meal is taking me through the stages of life right now. >> I think that's what a last meal kind of should be. You know what I mean? Something to remind you where you came from, where you're going, and ultimately, you know, >> most people would think a last meal should be just opulent, something amaz. But this is like, you know, they say you have that little flash and you see your whole life. I'm seeing it right now just through food. >> I'm curious if this triggers any childhood memories. If I said nagu, what does that mean? >> So, a lot of people give credit to the team at Nike for creating the just do it slogan. >> Mhm. >> When in reality in 1995 when we came to America, my dad would frequently say nimagu anytime I complained and chases nimagu in Russian means literally going through I can't which roughly translates to just do it. And anytime I would complain in middle school about learning English, in high school about taking SATs, in college preparing for MCATs, in medical school preparing for residency, is nimagu. That was the statement we live by. >> And it's a very USSR mentality. >> Mhm. >> Like I don't think that flies this day and age in the US. I don't know how you feel about that. >> Well, no. I think it's a funny um there's like this paradox around the idea of adversity, right? where it's obvious that it should be a parent's goal to give their child a comfortable life. But then by giving their child a comfortable life, they don't give them the opportunity to overcome anything to ultimately drive towards success or self-esteem and sort of creating this, you know, weird cycle. I don't know if you want to have kids, but you know, have you thought have you thought about >> No. And I my friend uh one of my close friends just had a a baby and uh is considering a second >> and I asked him cuz he's setting up his bank account or something for future college stuff. I said like you're significantly higher wealth than when your parents came to America. How do you want your child to grow up? And he said all the great things. I want them to have good values. I want him to work hard. >> But on a practical level, I don't think most people have thought it that far through because it's it's really hard to think about it um proactively before the moment happens in a hypothetical sense. >> Oh yeah, man. Think it over a chicken bake. Um so this is called a Costco chicken bake. Now, this is a I I would probably call this technically a cowzone or a strong bowl. Um, this is a a pizza dough that has been crusted in cheese, but then also stuffed with cheese, chicken, bacon, and a heavy mayonnaise-based Caesar dressing. This is the unhealthiest thing in humanity. And honestly, I blame my cholesterol levels on my childhood. And partially, I might consider a class action against Costco. >> I'll explain. >> We'll put a link uh below. Join it today. All I ate at some point in my life, I don't remember the years, Snicker bars from Costco that my dad would buy in a 48 count, this chicken bake, sometimes two when I wanted to put on muscle. And this has like 1,000 calories or something wild in it, and then a muffin. And those muffins were delicious at Costco. >> Hear me out, though. Muffins used to be healthy. That was I'm saying we used to call them healthy. You weren't eating cake. You were eating a muffin. in a muffin was breakfast and breakfast was healthy. So back then, Mike, we didn't know. It's like cigarettes in the ' 50s with doctors. >> Yeah. >> But wow, this brings back a lot of memories. And I remember cuz I would eat this while watching TV. All the oil would drip out the back and burn me because the inside is way hotter than the outside when you cut it. >> I feel like I know the answer, but I'm curious about your parents coming from the USSR, their messaging about American abundance and capitalism. Cuz Costco, there's no place like it in the world. >> No. When you walked in there, were they like, "Hell yes, this is what we came here for." Or were they like, "100%." >> Yeah. It was dream world. Our entertainment for the first 5 years in America while we were getting up off our feet was going to these three stores. Nobody beats The Whiz, which is an electronic store similar to PC Richards, huh? Got you. >> Dwayne Reed. >> Mhm. >> And Staples. And there was a specific path we took almost three nights a week with my parents. We would walk through these stores and imagine the one day we can buy a boom box. >> Yeah. >> When we went to Staples, they had pens that were like 50 bucks cuz they were nice. I would touch the grips on them and just say, "One day I'm going to get a nice pen like this." Because I couldn't even get the regular pens. My parents were trying to save money. So like your dad when he came here, I mean he had to completely re like go to medical school again, do his residency again, learn English from scratch. Your mom was sweeping floors despite having a PhD in mathematics. How much pressure did you feel to like honor what they had done? Or did you have that rebellious teen phase of I'm taking this for granted? >> Never really rebelled. I was always a good student. Also because my dad set really clean rules for me. M you could hang out with your friends, you could enjoy your time, but you have to do good in school. And that sort of fairness made me believe in what he was saying and want to work harder. But it it basically took away my ability to have excuses. >> Yeah. >> Which is unique because some research, and this is not like a foolproof thing cuz it's easy on podcasts to be like, did you know that when you make an excuse, your brain actually functions at 20%. No. >> Yeah. There's some preliminary research that shows that the more you make excuses, that could perhaps set you up for failure at a higher rate. Because I had no ability to make an excuse, because no one was there to listen to it, it made me less likely to use it. It seems like we're in a time in America right now that is very unique in terms of the way that people trust expertise. >> And initially, I was going to say the medical system, there seems to be a lot of distrust in it, but I think it just goes to experts everywhere. But I think there's a unique pain for doctors where you've gone to medical school, you've, you know, put in a decade of your life, hundreds of thousands of dollars to try and earnestly help people and then you're sort of met with this strange misplaced vitriol. Like how much have you seen that rise over the years and was there like a single trigger moment? >> Yeah, the big turning point was the pandemic. Um I think when medicine got lumped into the political system as much as it had to during a moment of crisis uh as we were living at the time that fueled a lot of distrust because it felt like medicine is inherently political but it became partisan. >> Yeah. >> Where one party was saying one thing and another party was saying another thing. It didn't seem like it was based on science. And at times we should have owned that. We should have said that. We should have said what we didn't know. We weren't great at communicating. Also, new virus, new situation, unheard of, unprecedented moment. So, but what upsets me about the situation most now is not just the loss of trust in health care professionals and agencies, but it's misplaced anger at health care professionals. We did not suddenly start gaslighting our patients more often. the system has gotten to such a breaking point that it sets up for the whole visit, the whole experience of being in healthcare to suck. And because we're on the front lines, it looks like we're in charge of it. When if a patient asks me what the cost of an MRI is over medication, I have zero clue because we don't make any money off of that. That is not tied to any kind of success as a physician. and people who are using it for their political partisan purposes are great at weaponizing that. >> One thing I love about watching you in the Jubilee surrounded videos, right, is that you have this Shaolin monk level of resilience, at least from my perspective, you were sitting there for what must be a 3 and 1 half, 4 hour shoot as people are just coming in and saying all kinds of crazy things, accusations towards you of you never get partisan and you also never seem to like talk down to people in a way. It seems like you're always trying to connect on a human level, which is what I think makes it so unique and also so unique from just like a political debate. This is about real human lives. I think the most important thing in science is to be a good skeptic, a healthy skeptic. And that means approaching things with a appropriate level of skepticism. Not too far where you become a cynic and disbelieve everything and not gullible enough that you believe everything. So what good scientists have is a level of humility to always want to challenge themselves. That if they come up with a breakthrough, they want to challenge that breakthrough as much as they can before other people challenge them so that they're not proven wrong by someone else. >> And if they can't find a hole in their logic despite them trying, they know that they have a strong theory. But what has happened and what has changed completely is now with the age of social media, people who are coming up with theories are looking for support as opposed to challenging their own theories. And there was no better example of that than I had an interview with the psychiatrist on my podcast the other day, uh, Dr. Daniel Aemon, and I asked him that question about his controversial brain scans, his spec scans. I said, ' Don't you want to try and prove yourself wrong so that your idea gets better and more steadfast in the era of criticism? He said, "No, not at all." And he's just so honest about it. And I can't believe that that's where we are. >> Yeah. >> And partially what I think happens in this important cycle of having humility as scientists is that we had humility in science, but we lacked humility in communication. M >> so especially during the pandemic a lot of medical experts came up as all knowing and laughing at people who disagreed with them and that's not the way you approach it because it's so easy to miss what someone has gone through on an emotional level cuz at the end of the day if we're both trying to seek truth >> we should both be learning and I think that's a cool philosophy. >> I think one of the most harmful things of the 2020s has been the want for someone to dunk on another person. If we could all just pre I mean this so sincerely. If we could all prevent the urge of wanting to dunk on someone metaphorically, literally jamming in their face like Sean K, but just wanting to talk down to someone. >> Supersonics. >> That's best in-game dunker. Back like back to back to the point like really trying to make yourself feel better by talking down to somebody. It is indulgent. It's narcissistic and it's making the problem worse. >> It's financially lucrative to do that these days. And my hope, because the human mind is great at adaptation, especially at scale over time, that people will ultimately get sick of that level of dunking >> and no longer support it with their clicks. That's my hope, my optimistic self. >> Dr. Mike, for the third course of your final meal, we have the New York style pepperoni pizza with extra cheese and the cheeseburger from Four Charles Prime Rib. >> Oh my god. >> Golly, where are we >> together? Which one? What do you go for first? >> I think you should go burger first cuz I think once pizza rests a little bit, I think it gets better. >> Um, so for the burger, so we tried to faithfully recreate this as much as possible. We actually cured and smoked our own bacon, and then slow brazed it to get it tender just like they do, chilled it, sliced it, fried it off, crusted with a little bit of black pepper, double Wagyu smash patty with their signature sauce, a little bit of Tabasco in there, the fried egg, and then of course your classic American cheese. Wow. So, next time I struggle getting a reservation, I'm just hitting you up for this. >> I was gonna ask because I know you said one of your favorite flexes when you started your Instagram was being able to get into nightclubs, but showing them followers literally. >> Can that get you into this restaurant, Fort Charles? >> I don't know about Fort Charles, but it definitely works in restaurants. >> Like, there was a restaurant I would go to quite often. It doesn't exist anymore. But you know when you walk into a restaurant, they print out some paper and then the hostess goes to seat you and that paper is like folded into some kind of little pamphlet. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> She accidentally put it on the table and I'm like, "Oh, what is this? Must be someone else check." I open it. It has my subscriber count. It has the last drinks that I ordered, the order of which I like my And I'm like, "Wow, these companies know everything." >> That's good hospitality. >> Good hospitality. Or Russian spies. Believe me, I have that sphere of communism in the back of my head. >> Dig into the burger, though. >> Oh, look at that. >> Oh, no. Boy, this is the killer. This is like how they stop showing smoking in movies. They need to stop showing us. >> So good. Do you think the American Heart Association is going to end my partnership with them after this? >> I think it's good. We don't even have to air this episode, Mike. We just get B-roll of you eating a salad. >> God, that burger is so good. The pizza with extra cheese. This is obviously a New York staple, but the extra cheese is frankly never a request that we field it here. >> You know what's funny? No one ever orders extra cheese. And I'm like, how do you not order extra cheese? It's the essence of the pizza. >> That's fair. I guess I sometimes like pizza with no cheese. I'm kind of a crazy person. I'm there I'm really there for the red sauce and the burnt bread and I love that. >> Wow. Do you eat the crust? >> I do eat the crust. >> I do not touch the crust. That is a hack. You were born in the Soviet Union. Like there's people starving in Russia. You're not eating the crusts. >> How do you think I'm able to polish off a large pie by myself crust? Yeah. I'm only eating >> the crust are for the dogs. Uh David, do you dress it up with the parm and the >> I I just like a little spice. >> Hell yeah. >> Sometimes a little garlic if that's available. >> Are you Are you breathing heavy? And can you accurately medically describe what's happening to our bodies as we start sweating? in the >> our our furnaces are being turned on in order to burn off this this meal and to metabolize this meal. Our bodies are secretreting all sorts of gastric juices breakdown products are being absorbed. >> See, this is the Brooklyn staple right here. >> Mhm. I want to go back to when you were in medical school and your mom passed away cuz you said she passed away from cancer, but I believe what ultimately led to her death was the aggressive treatment of the cancer, >> especially coming from a family where the son's in medical school and the dad's a doctor. That's a very heady thing to process. >> Was any part of you at that point, I know you're young in medical school, but like questioning what the doctor was doing with your mom's treatment? No, I to be honest, I wasn't sure even what treat my they did a good job shielding me and allowing me to know the minimum amount for me to just be part of the family but not know all of it. >> Sure. >> Which is nice of them because I was growing up with a lot of responsibilities and I understand why they did that. But uh the one disagreement that I had with my dad is when she took a turn for the worst which was the day of uh the day after my finals and I actually went with them to like the the sequence of events was such I took my finals. I went home and uh I was at my girlfriend's house at the time and my sister calls me really late at night and she goes, "Mom is not feeling well. You have to take her in." So I take her in. She actually gets cleared to leave. And the doctor shakes my hand and says, "She's good. Like the cancer is is basically gone. We just need her to rehabilitate because she had a stem cell transplant." And that destroyed her immune system. And then I took her home. And then the following night is when she really got bad. And when we went to uh the hospital with uh my dad and now my sister uh to Memorial Stone Kettering, she was in the ICU heavily sedated, really sick. And at that point, I knew there was nothing good coming of this. >> And that's when my dad was still optimistic and I was like in judgment mode. Like, dad, what are you saying? This is not a good position. >> Was that just him shielding himself? Cuz obviously had more medical knowledge than you did at the time. >> Yeah. To be honest, he's so closed off with his feelings on the subject that it would be hard to know. He was definitely way overly optimistic in partially believing in America almost as a symbolism of look how much we have here. we have to be able to save her. >> But the human body is so complex in that once you reach a certain point, all the amazing treatments that we have can only go so far. >> That was the only argument that we had and it was very shortlived cuz unfortunately later that day was when she passed. So >> does that affect the way that you treat patients today? Like is that a moment that still lives heavily in your mind of the certainty of she's going to be okay, she's >> um not that. But there is something from that day that I took away from uh and used in my practice which is carrying myself around patients when they are either losing or just lost a loved one >> and how you behave even when you're not speaking to them because I remember we were waiting for paperwork after that happened and I heard the nurses laughing in the nursing station. Nothing to do with my family completely their own stuff. they needed to disconnect. >> But how angry it made my dad and how angry it made me. And it reminded me >> in my residency days to remind my colleagues, hey, >> this is an awful time for people and I've been there. So like anything we can do to just move away after we have our initial conversation is valuable. >> And I think the only way I could have known that is by having that real life experience. >> Yeah. I uh I was kind of joking about the scar here and you know me not wanting to go to my doctor's appointment and that's because I have spent years and years not going to the doctor because of traumatic incidents happening in you know uh in in hospitals when my dad passed away. It's something I've never really said on the show but I think it has a lot of similar similarities to your mom. I've always kind of framed it as he went in for an aortic aneurysm repair and never came out you know at 64 years old. What actually happened though is I was um traveling to the Junior National Hammerthrow Championships. Uh and so I couldn't be there. I was in Oregon while he was getting surgery. So I was super worried the whole time, but I get a call from the, you know, hospital that, hey, everything went well in the surgery. He's up. He's cracking dirty jokes. He's fine. Uh and I go, oh great. And then I, you know, have the phone, go through a day of, uh, practice, come back, and I have a voicemail just saying, um, hey, you're going to want to sit down when you hear this. And it was from my brother and still don't know what happened, but he slipped into a or they had to put him in a medically induced coma. I don't know if he got sepsis or something, got infected. I remember going to the hospital and a doctor saying, "It's not an if he gets out of the coma, it's when he gets out of the coma." And then over the course of 7 days, I just watched a father, a man, a soul gradually and brutally turn into a corpse. And it was one of the most harrowing experiences of my life that one kind of taught me that there there's there are better deaths than others, >> you know, and that's something that I wouldn't want any of my relatives to to suffer >> sure >> from myself. But it was this echo in my mind of it's not an if, it's a it's a when. And then you know gradually it going well the toes are necrotic now but you know he doesn't really need toes now the whole foot's necrotic and but we can just cut off the foot. He's just gonna have an artificial heart. So isn't it cool that your dad's not going to have a pulse but it's just going to be pumping blood throughout his whole body. Haha. He's going to wake up and then he never did. And so you know those experiences um they stick with you for a while and even on the smallest thing of like going to get a checkup you know the thing that can Yeah. Why why do you think they were being so optimistic or did you not think about that at the time? >> I told you earlier like I don't want to know anything that's happened to me partly because of that trauma but part of it's also I I trust the experts but can I read an Elizabeth Kuba Ross quote to you? Yeah. >> Because I started reading trying to figure out why they were so optimistic >> and in her book on death and dying she writes in the postworld war II era optimism and defiance pervaded America's orientation towards illness. The sense was that medical science might soon be able to arrest aging and subconsciously at least conquered death itself. It was the idea that the American medical system, as your dad kind of thought, we had so much. And also, we just won World War II. Medical advances were happening so fast, but now the medical systems, you know, trying to play God, extending life at all costs, have a certain amount of bravado in the answers. Do you still feel like that pervades the American medical system? >> I think in in one major way, yes. in that we spend a ton of money and effort into people's last few days, weeks, months. >> Yeah. >> Not winning anything for that person >> and not being clear in our communication like you experienced. What you should have had happened was the doctor should have been very clear about expectations >> so that you can prepare yourself for how to behave and how to feel. >> Yeah. Um the the idea of now not wanting to know stems probably from the fact that when you did want to know you got wrong information. How powerful would have been in that moment >> to hear the truth and we don't know why this is happening. We don't know how to fix this but we're going to try our best and we're going to be here to answer any questions you might have. Would you have been mad if you heard that? >> You know what the messed up thing is? Yeah. >> What would you have felt? >> I I would have gone, you're a doctor, you don't know. which I'm sure you get all the time. >> And here's the thing. What we're supposed to do is own that. >> What a tremendously difficult situation for you to be in. And I'm putting myself in. >> First of all, don't put You had a terrible scenario. You don't need to put yourself in their shoes. >> Although, I don't mean to project it on to you, Mike, talking to him, but >> you're not. But it's true. Like, it's it's great that you're exhibiting charitable thinking, but it's appropriate for you to feel the negativity that you feel. That sucks, man. I'm really sorry that that uh >> No, I mean experience happened. you've been through so much with that. Even looking at the nurses laughing, I I remember you talking about that and me just feeling like sick inside. But empathizing with them, >> they're at their job and they're seeing all these, you know, I think >> not apologizing for your emotions, but having empathy for that of others, but like looking back at this doctor, I would have been pissed. I would have been pissed for 40 seconds. It's uncomfortable to sit in that doubt if we don't know what's going to happen. It's uncomfortable for a doctor to say, "Hey, I'm you you saw my nice car out front and I still don't know." I think it's one of those moments where had he told you the truth shortterm it would have not been good but longterm it would have been better not just for you but I'm thinking even more zoomed out holistically because if he's doing that to you odds are that's happening across the board and that's how we lose people when we communicate poorly. So my hope is that from situations when you speak up like you are now and they're telling millions of people about it, me sharing the story about my mom, people will feel more comfortable to talk openly about it, to challenge their doctors to ask questions. And if you ever have a doctor that doesn't like that you ask questions or if you have a doctor that says you Googled your symptoms, do you know you can't replace my degree with a Google search or chat GPT search? Switch. I know that comes from a position of privilege at times, but do your best to switch because those people will not go to bat for you. they will leave you more confused. And really the true art in practicing medicine in this era is not about knowing the most statistics. Now with all the information being so searchable and available, it's about application to another human and transfer of that knowledge to another human. So the big part of what I do as a family medicine doctor is I try and encourage patients to think about their thoughts >> and to be okay with the idea of uncertainty. How many times does a patient come in and say, "Doctor, I had this twinge. I want to make sure it's not a heart attack. I want to make sure it wasn't a heart attack." Then right away after doing an exam and talking to them longer and making sure that there's no true sign of a heart attack, I explain that I can't tell them that they're not going to have a heart attack when they walk out of the office. >> And that's a tough conversation to have in 10 minutes, >> but it's a mandatory one. So, thank you for sharing that. >> Dr. Mike, for the final course of your final meal on Earth, we have baklava and the cookies and cream milkshake. We might classic with this one. I've heard you talk about this for years and now we are faithful. >> So pretty. I've never had it so pretty. I usually just get in like a Carell cup or a BaskinRobins cup. >> We wanted to do it up nice for you. So we've actually uh put a little bit of salt and a little bit of malt powder in there. I think that really increases the experience. >> Wait, tell me what malt powder is and what it what it how does it impact the experience. >> So malt I almost describe it as like MSG is to savory foods as malt is to sweet foods. So they actually add a lot of uh malt powder in the or the the British army used to give it out for like you know uh health and calories and maintenance of the troops in the 1900s but it is just fermented grains that have been allowed uh I think moltos to to form through the fermentation process and it's just this like lingering sensation on the pallet that I find delightful. And then salt of course just heightens your taste experience with everything. Blended some Oreos into uh McConnell's vanilla ice cream. The best vanilla ice cream in the game. Fresh Oreo, whipped cream, cherry. Oh my god. And the best part, thick straw. >> Thick straw. >> Thank you. >> When they when you get a perfect milkshake and you get one of these thin straws and you can't even get a little bit of cookie in there, >> ruins it. >> Oh, that's good. >> I guess you still being a practicing doctor. Do you think that you'll retire first from being a practicing doctor or from making content? >> No. No. I want to be a practicing doctor for as long as humanly possible. the content creation, as long as it's more beneficial to the world, I'll keep doing it. But personally, I enjoy being in the exam room a lot more. I can never lose that. In fact, when all this BuzzFeed stuff happened, the first thing that my friends and even casual acquaintances said was like, "Okay, so when are you going to stop practicing medicine? You going to drop out of residency?" All those questions came and it has nothing to do with the money. It's just I love it. It's what I want to do. And in fact, when social media is a disaster, views aren't coming or videos get blocked, whatever happens, the happiness always returns, not because I have some amazing experience at work, but because it's normal. You talk to people who are going through And yet, I could see easily on the other side when you're in on that hamster wheel, that's something that you lose appreciation for. So, I think the fact that I live in these two different worlds and straddle them, it actually somehow works. And I don't think I should swap one for another ever. >> Yeah. >> You did a great podcast with um hospice nurse Julie. >> Yeah. >> And you were talking about the idea of miracles, right? Both you and her of course being people of science. Julie at least said that she had >> witnessed what she believed to be a miracle >> and you a little bit more hesitant to use that term. >> When other people, especially in a medical setting, are witnessing a miracle, what do you think they're actually witnessing? I'm probably stealing this from someone else. But I think when we don't understand stuff, we call it miracles. >> Sure. >> For the same reason that you're mad at that doctor >> is the same reason I refuse to say that that was a miracle because I don't want to give the false hope. I don't want them to believe that they need a miracle. I want them to believe in what is capable, what we can do, what we can't do, and become comfortable with that. It's very easy to influence our patients one way or another. Even the way when I listen to someone's heart or their lungs, the words I use can have such a drastic different impact on them. I could say, "Oh, your cough. Oh, I'm hearing a lot of fluid. I'm very concerned." That can fuel so much anxiety. Yeah. >> Versus, >> "Oh, I heard something and you know, it's a little bit of fluid and I think you have an infection. We need some antibiotics. That should kick it right away." giving that reassurance, as long as it's accurate, of course, >> versus scaring them is the correct approach. And I never want to scare or oversell anything. So that's why I'm always like, if someone else is going to talk about miracles, it's not going to be me, it's going to be someone else. >> And for some people, they need that, you know? So, who am I to judge if if that benefits someone's resilience? Having been there at the beginning of many people's lives and having been there, I assume at the end of many people's lives, I've delivered babies that are still my patient today 10 years in which is pretty cool watching them grow up like like they're coming in with a Starbucks cup and I'm like, "What? I I I delivered you. Like this is crazy." I mean, not me, but you know, >> I participated in the delivery. The mom delivered the >> baby. But what do you ultimately think happens when you die? because I wasn't raised with religion. >> Yeah. >> I don't have I'm almost agnostic about what happens after you die. And I wish I wasn't. I wish there was something that I could convince myself of or believe in. But I think if you look at the difference between lifespans and quality of life, those who are pessimistic are more accurate but have a worse quality of life. Yeah. And those who are optimistic have a better quality of life but are less accurate. Sure. >> So I'm sacrificing the quality of my life to be more accurate in some ways. Even though earlier today I was optimistic. So >> Sure. >> How many years off your life would you be willing for cookies and cream milkshakes to take before you stop drinking them? If they said you're going to >> I also don't drink these often now. I'm really trying to clean up my act. I think, oh, the other day, uh, I've been really good for a few weeks, like really exercising a lot, watching, uh, my calories, my increasing my fiber, and I said, you know what? It's Sunday. I'm going to order a milkshake. It's 10:00. I order from one place, 3-hour estimated delivery. I'm like, that's not So, this one's not going to work. Let me order from another place. Second place, oh, we're 10 minutes away from your house. Cool. I'm going to cancel the other one. I cancel the other one. the one that's 10 minutes away text me, "Hey, I just got into a car accident, so I won't be able to get I'm" I'm like, "All right, clearly I'm not meant to have this milkshake." No milkshakes tonight. So, thank you for providing me the milkshake after that. >> And that's the closest Dr. Mike will get to believing in God. >> He doesn't get a milkshake. >> Yeah. See, >> and you do today. >> There you go. >> You ready to go to the lightning round? >> I Oh, there's a lighting on. Okay. Who's the one person dead or alive you'd want to share your actual last meal with? >> Oh. Oh, dead or alive? God, that's so hard. I want to do it with my dad. I feel like there's a lot for us to look back on and and chat about. >> What song do you want to be played at your funeral? >> That Eminem and Skyler Gay song, I need a doctor. That's a good one. >> Hell yeah. Who's one snake oil peddler that you'd like to box? >> RFK all day long. >> Come on. >> Come on. >> We can give all the pay-per-view to the >> Yeah, whatever. I'll give it anywhere. the anti-war on saturated fights charity of his choice. >> We will do it whatever it needs to happen. Let's do a tag team boxing match. Jake, Paul, RFK, cuz they're buddies and me and whoever else they want and I I'll do it. >> You and who? Sanjay Gupta. Like who's who's >> I'll take Sanjay Gupta. He was sexiest doctor alive before me. I took away his crown. >> How many other sexiest doctors? >> I don't know. But that was the only one. But >> uh what's your biggest fear? I would probably say making that making a mistake with a patient >> because that's that's the worst feeling in the world. And I I fight that to this day tooth and nail to the point where even when I'm prescribing something as simple as an antibiotic that I've used, you know, many times in the last few weeks. I still recheck dosages. I still recheck and run every interaction check because I'm just I don't want to make that mistake ever. >> What's your greatest regret? >> Probably not spending more time with my family. I always wanted to get out of the house and be with my friends and sleep over and do this. And because my family was always so busy, my dad going through medical school, my mom trying to get a job, we were always kind of in different places, it would have been nice to spend more time together, learn more about one another. I think that would be more fun. >> Yeah. >> Do you regret not applying to be the Bachelor when Chris Harrison himself said you should? >> Um, I don't know if I'm allowed to say it, but it's so far away. They offered it and >> they fully offered it. Well, you know, whatever. Like they were saying like, "We'd like for you to take the next steps." And don't think that was a every media thing I've participated in, >> I only chose to do because I felt like it made me have an opportunity to be a better doctor. So, I even remember when I when I first had the little sexy doctor thing happen, >> they invited me on some talk show to talk about fitness. And they said, "The producer will meet you at the gym. You'll work out together. You talk about the benefits of exercise." And when I got there, they're like, "All right, well, take off your shirt and we'll start working out." And I'm like, "I'm a doctor like you." And I just walked out and I left. And the producer got mad. They yelled at their underling. They cried. They called. They try to reschedule. Cuz to me, all of the popularity, the financial benefits, all that is secondary to practicing good medicine. So, finally, Dr. Mike, are you happy >> after cookies and cream milkshake? Of course. >> Even if it's just the dopamine levels spiking. Hey, man. >> I'm not going to judge it. I'm going to enjoy it. I still have a little bit of shake left. >> I'm incredibly happy. Truly, I I look up to you as a person, the work that you've done so so so much. And frankly, I'm like very glad that we have people like you in the world. >> Thank you. I I appreciate that. And I'm not great at taking compliments, but I'm going to I'm going to try my best to take that because uh you lose sight sometimes of the impact you have on the world when you're staring at a camera all day. And it's nice to see that you can connect with another human being uh without Zooms, without Instagrams or Facebooks. So, thank you for that. >> Of course, man. If you want to deliver your last words to that camera right there. >> As always, stay happy and healthy. >> There he is. Dr. Mike Paravski. Everybody, uh, you got anything to plug? Regularly scheduled checkups still once a year on the physicals. Yeah, definitely at least once a year. Invest in a primary care doctor. Invest in a primary care doctor. Nurture that relationship as long as you can because urgent care does not replace primary care. >> Amen. Colonoscopies, how often? >> Starting age 45 or 10 years before a first-degree relative was first diagnosed. >> Gotcha. And this is professionally based or you can do amateur. >> I didn't know there is there an amateur colonoscopy. >> Found it on Groupon. >> Oh, call back See you on the side. >> Get your new last meals hoodie now at mythical.com.