(upbeat music) – Welcome to Ear Biscuits, I’m Rhett. – And I’m Link. This week at the round table of dim lighting we’re gonna be going down the rabbit hole. We have an envelope here, it’s sealed inside of it is a question from a mythical beast. – I can almost read it but– – Don’t! – But I’m gonna wait, I’m gonna wait, I’m gonna wait. – It’s gonna begin a conversation that– – Could go anywhere, left, right, down, up. – Oh it’s gonna go down. – North east. – Down in the hole. Before we open that envelope though I would just ask if you would allow me to share a big milestone that is about to happen in my life. – Okay, well ask me then. – Would you mind if I shared a joyous occasion which is happening days from now that is milestone in my life? – I’d rather you not. (laughing) No, sure, go ahead. – Everyday when I get home I pull up in my driveway and I turn off my car and I reach up and I push the button to open my garage door. – You open your garage door? There’s not even a car in there. – That’s right. – What are you doing there? – I use it to enter the house. I walk through the garage and then I walk through the door that’s inside of the garage to get in my house as opposed to walking just to the left of the garage and going in the front door. – Now you do realize you use significantly more electricity entering I know that this is a concern of yours. As someone who really cares about energy efficiency the garage door opening is much less energy efficient than you walking 10 more feet to go to the front door. But you can do whatever you want to because I don’t really care. – Don’t try to mess up my milestone. (Rhett laughs) Because what I do is then I close the garage door behind me and that’s where my shoes are kept. There at the door from the garage into the house. – You take your shoes off in the garage? – I take my shoes off in the garage I put on my slippers, then I go in the house. I’m like Mr. Rogers, man. – Oh gosh. – Put on my sweater then I go in the house I’m like hello wife and kids and dog, daddy’s home. Every morning when I get up to come to work I exit that way, I exit through the house into the garage and I put on my shoes and if I’m going to the gym I put on my heavy coat ’cause I’m cold natured and I like to wear a heavy coat. – You keep your coat in the garage as well? – Yeah, there’s a coat rack in the garage. Then I walk– – Can I just interject, you do realize you’re strange? I mean, it’s cool, I respect every bit of it and I’m glad that it makes you happy but you do understand that some of the things– – I haven’t gotten to the thing that makes me happy. – No some of the things that you just described if I didn’t know you, I’d be like hmm I’d be like what else am I gonna find out about this guy? – Well. – He keeps his coats and his shoes in his garage insists on entering through this portal and changing into a different person. – Portal, portal, that’s a good word. I treat it like my portal. – It’s just unusual. Unusual is great, I’m just making do you know that it’s unusual? – Well before I answer that, let me add this just as a side note. When I get to the gym, I take off my coat and I turn it inside out. – Okay. – I hang it on a hook in the gym and then I workout, get all sweaty then I put on my coat inside out and then I go out to my car I get my keys from what is now an internal pocket of my coat ’cause of how I’m wearing it. I crank up my car and I drive home. When I get home, I open the garage door I enter my portal, I take off the coat and turn it right side out and hang it back on the hook. – I understand. – Thereby keeping all the sweaty Linkness. – On the outside. – On the outside of the coat. – So let me just say. – But then the next morning, I’m putting the unsweaty. – We understand. I respect it, I think that it’s completely. – Genius. – It’s all justified. It’s all very well thought out but I just learned something about you and it’s like this weird inside after knowing you all this time. Sometimes. – I haven’t gotten to the milestone yet but go ahead. – Sometimes I look at you, as I’m speaking or as other people are speaking and I can tell that you’re not present. – Oh I thought you just, with pride. – That too. – Just a little tear in your eye. – Sometimes I feel– – That I’m not listening? – Yes and I feel like I ask the question to myself you know, we spend a lot of time together I think I asked this question to myself 27 to 29 times a week. What is Link thinking about right now? (Link laughs) And you’re coming up with these freaking systems. Is this what’s going on when we’re in the middle of something and then you’re just gone? Are you, like, thinking about oh I gotta turn the jacket inside out, that’s it! – Maybe. – Is that where all the brain power is going? (laughing) To these systems? Because I mean, that’s a great system, I totally get it. I mean, I think people out there are gonna be like I’m gonna do the inside out coat thing. I understand it’s completely logical it’s just, it’s interesting that these systems are so in tact and so developed. – Well it’s ironic because it’s supposed to free me up for efficiencies for other things in life. Like not having to wash my coat or worry about. – Because that’s a big problem for Americans. (laughs) – Well there’s a best way to do everything. – Coat washing. – My industrial engineering degree I don’t know if it planted this information. – You were attracted to that field. – I was attracted to that discipline because of the way my brain thinks so systematically superior to other people that I podcast with. – As a child, I had no, I didn’t know this about you I guess kids don’t think about this kind of stuff at least, we didn’t. – Right, I mean I wrote in The Book of Mythicality that, like, I petted my dog Tucker five times on the head. – But you didn’t share that with me, I didn’t know. – No I didn’t share that with anybody, not even Tucker. – He knew, dogs can count to three I think it’s been proven. – So this portal is a special place to me because it is, I’m so glad you called it a portal. – Well it’s more like a Holodeck. – Because it transfers me into the world and then back into my safe nest. – It’s like the bridge. – It is the bridge. – What is the place on Star Trek where you materialize? – The Holodeck. – No the Holodeck is where you go to experience, like, a virtual reality. But what is it called where they beam you up? – I really like Star Wars. – Star Trek is the thinking man’s Star Wars. (laughing) – Star Trek is – [All] The thinking man’s Star Wars. – Yep, you heard it here. Gene Roddenberry. – Oh gosh. So it’s a special place to me. The washer and dryer are also in there. – I’ve seen this. – I will say that. As well as all the cabinetry that was in my house when I first bought it in the kitchen and it was ugly so we put it in the garage. – Right, put it in the portal. – We also have all the rugs on the floor of the garage that we no longer wanted in the house for whatever decorating reasons no longer fit in the house. – Yeah there’s a lot of thought that’s gone into it I had noticed that. – So it kind of looks like a yurt in there. There’s like mal-matching rugs just everywhere but there’s also a couple of things which have plagued me. I cannot stand walking through what I believe to be I thought my domain, now it’s my portal to and from the world, it’s clutter. I mean, there’s a lamp, three lamps, a chair. Different stuff, there’s a recliner that some friends let us borrow when Lily was going through her back surgery that now she doesn’t need, they don’t want it back and they haven’t come to pick it up so it’s in the garage. There’s a go-kart that I bought for the kids from a neighbor because we can drive it on our street because it’s a private street, legally. They never got into it. There’s a carrier that I bought to put on top of our car to hold luggage so that we could all go somewhere as a family. – It’s big, especially when you’re just right next to it on the ground. – I can’t get out of my portal walking around all this stuff I’m seeing it twice a day at least. – Especially in slippers. – It became to symbolize clutter comes to symbolize everywhere in my life but specifically here in my portal just a lack of control over my life. I just cannot walk through that multiple times a day. I will tell you that today somebody came and picked up that go-kart because for a whole year, I’ve been like I’m gonna get rid of this go-kart. I put it on craigslist. – Oh no. – I put it on craigslist, $200 or best offer. Within an hour, somebody’s calling to come get it. Within an hour, I could have done this a year ago! What are these people, who wants a go-kart in Los Angeles? – How did you communicate with the craigslist contact? Burner phone? (Link chuckles) – I got Jenna to talk to them. – Okay. – So I did not personally talk to them because I didn’t wanna bring that into the mix. I didn’t wanna be there when they picked it up because I didn’t want them to know this was my house. – You didn’t wanna say, go-kart owned by Link Neal? (laughs) – I could have got, maybe I could have got more money. – You could have gotten 350, 350, 375 maybe. – Because it was at my house. You don’t really like people coming to your house off craigslist but I was that desperate to get rid of it. – Meet him at Starbucks, drive the go-kart to Starbucks. – The moment we post, someone’s like oh I’ve been waiting for one of those, or whatever. – Oh everybody’s in the market for a go-kart. I’m in the market, you didn’t even tell me you were selling it. – Then we, you know what? We loaded up the recliner and got it out of there and returned it, we said we’re not gonna keep asking you to come get it, the loaner recliner we’re gonna bring it to you tomorrow this is gonna be over ’cause that’s been 10 months. – They didn’t just pawn it off on you? – They were like okay, they kind of did. Obviously they didn’t want it ’cause it’s been there for 10 months. They didn’t want their recliner back. – Well they didn’t need it anymore ’cause their daughter is recovered as well. – Yeah but he had it in his office. – Oh, okay. – Got rid of that and I bought a rope hoist. – Uh-oh. – Put that up and it holds the carrier and it levitates it above the garage door. – That sounds dangerous. – Well, it’s off the floor. I could literally, I know this sounds crazy. – Yeah, we’ve been there for a while. – What I’m about to say sounds crazy. I could literally park a car in my garage. – But you don’t wanna do that. – Just think about that for a second. – Nobody does that in California. – Nobody does that anywhere with a garage. – Oh come on. – Unless you live in like, frigid places and you have to. – Well that’s a lot of places. – Okay, okay, that’s fair. – Don’t forget so soon what the weather is like in other places. – That’s true. But nowhere where weather is not a factor does anybody use a garage other than keeping all the crap that they don’t want in their house. – Rainy places too, cold places and rainy places. We don’t have cold, we don’t have rain. – It’s tough though. I know it’s tough for everybody, even if you got rain. To keep the clutter out of there and I guarantee you, what I’m gonna do what I’m gonna do is I’m gonna drive my car and I’m gonna park it in there. – But that’s invading the portal. – I’m gonna do it once just to say I did it then you know what? The next day there’s gonna be something there. – You might drive over a slipper. – Three years ago. Three years ago, I got the garage clean enough right when we moved in and I was so proud, I went in the house and I was like Christy, you gotta come out here and see this. She was like, I’m in the middle of something I was like, no, no, you gotta come out here and see this. I bring her out there by the arm I open up the– – You led her by the arm? – I led her by the arm, I said close your eyes brought her out into the garage next to where my slippers are said open your eyes, she opened her eyes and there was my car, parked in the garage. I was just beaming, I was like a kid who brought home straight As after failing. – Was she as excited as you were? – No. Not really. – oh I wouldn’t think so. – First thing she said was you can’t put the car in the garage. – Yep, she’s right. – This is the laundry room. (Rhett laughs) – Yeah so that really burst your bubble. – I was like just let it stay here tonight. – Yeah, let it get a taste. – So that one night it stayed there and now three years later, it’s about to happen again. It’s one of those moments in your life it’s a milestone moment when you can say, you know what? I had complete control over my life for one fortnight. – That’s an illusion. – It is an illusion, absolutely. – Don’t let her see it ’cause she’s gonna come out there and hate it again just like she did three years ago. Don’t lead her out this time. – I won’t. – You know it’s gonna be a disappointment. – It’s just for me, it’s just for me. – Don’t tell anybody. – Then the next day, I’ll come home, I’ll open the garage and I’m gonna pull on in and you know what? There’s gonna be three lamps, a chair and a toy that Lando doesn’t play with anymore. – Yeah, that’s what the garage is for. – A huge dinosaur. – The garage is the staging area for offing things. – I feel like I’m fresh. I feel like a fresh bag of chips, man. – Well don’t get used to it. – You know when you open that bag of chips and you look down in it, and you’re like man, it’s just a world of chips. I can find the perfect chip to eat first. I’m gonna find the one that’s folded over on itself. – You look into the chips? – And I’m gonna eat that one. – I open it and just begin eating. Again, just a different way of looking at things that’s what makes it so great. – When I open that jar of peanut butter take off that white seal underneath and then I’ll look and it’s a pristine it’s like the ocean on the calmest it’s like a lake on the calmest morning where you could just tiptoe across it like a ballerina. That’s what that peanut butter is like then you’re like, you know what? I’m just gonna sink my spoon and I’m gonna lick it clean. Only once will that happen with every jar. – That’s true. – Only once in three years will that happen with my portal. You wanna come over? – I’m proud of you, yeah I think I got all I needed from you just talking about it. I really appreciate it though, I’m very happy for you. (laughs) In the, what is the word I’m looking for? In the effort, in the spirit. In the spirit of moving along, yes. – I’m sorry I gushed a little bit. – We’re gonna get to this question in a second but first, I do want to let you know about these patches. Now you know, we wrote The Book of Mythicality and there is a real patch associated with very single chapter. – Oh yeah. – We made these patches and then there’s actual photos of the real patches that are associated with the theme of each chapter. They’re the kinds of patches that you can put on. – Your backpack. – Jackets, and they kind of tell a story all together the full range in mythicality as explained in The Book of Mythicality. Mythical.store you can get all of them. You can buy them individually, you can also buy them as a pack, right? – I don’t know if that’s true but just go over there and check it out. – Yeah, you’ll figure it out, you know? It’s all self-explanatory. Okay, let’s get into this question. – I just feel so good. I mean, I know that it’s not healthy. The illusion of control. – I don’t think you should tie your well-being into it. – I’m not, but I’m not gonna resist the feeling of feeling good because of it. I’m gonna put it in its place. – Ali Bee if I were to get cryogenically frozen when would I want to be woken up and what age would I want to be frozen? – The moment that I pull, I’ve already answered this. The moment I pull that car into the garage. – You wanna be frozen? – Freeze me. Freeze the whole thing. – Well but you don’t understand. It doesn’t take that moment that you’re experiencing and freeze it forever. It just, you basically die at that point and then there’s a very faint hope of you being awakened one day. (Link sighs) Okay, there’s a few things here. I’ve actually been thinking about a lot of things related to this. – Okay. – You know, not to short circuit this but cryogenics is not a thing, never will be. That’s my completely unprofessional opinion. I think by the time we figure out how to actually freeze somebody and wake them up we will have figured out a way to. – Transfer the– – Yeah offload people’s brains. – The psyche. – Into a computer or whatever. – I mean, are you trying to say that it’s not possible or that it won’t be the most proficient thing to do when you can just put it on a hard drive? That’s much easier. Once you figure that out, this will be an archaic technique. Even if it is possible. – I’m saying that the whole point of cryogenics is to essentially– – Stall. – Live forever. – Oh I thought you meant to stall until stuff is figured out. – We’re talking about immortality ultimately here, right? – Sure. – Because there’s the idea that in the physical world here there is the ultimate goal of humanity the thing that we’re all kind of working towards with our technology is never dying, defeating death, right? Cryogenics is just another way to defeat death but I think that some of the interesting things that are happening in this area are much more promising than cryogenics. This stem cell stuff, let’s talk about that in a completely uninformed way. – Unformed? – Uninformed. – Oh. (chuckles) – I will say, in one sense, these rabbit hole episodes are a lot like the Avett Brothers song where they talk about people love to talk on things they don’t know about. Let me just say that, that is what is happening here. (chuckles) We read enough to be a little bit dangerous in a conversation but not to be authoritative. – Well you’re talking about Mel Gibson bringing his doctor on Joe Rogan’s podcast. Who cares? I mean, we’re a podcast talking about a podcast we listen to, but that’s fine. – Yeah I just, I mean I don’t think that any of you come to listen to us speak for any sort of authoritative advice. If you do, I’m really concerned for you. But hopefully you come because this is entertaining conversation so that is what we’re gonna try to have. – We’re thought provoking. – We listen to– – Don’t come for answers, come for thoughts. – We listen to Joe Rogan’s podcast and he had Mel Gibson on. – Mel Gibson brought his doctor. – Mel Gibson brought his doctor. – Who treated his elderly father who was basically on his death bed with. – A bunch of problems. Multiple organ failure, he had issues. – He treated him down in Panama because it’s not legal in the U.S to treat someone with he type of stem cells that he was treated with intravenously and maybe perhaps otherwise. But he made a dramatic recovery. – I cannot remember the word, starts with an M. – Mel? – Me-za, something. There’s a certain type of stem cells that are basically, without getting into the specifics because we’re not gonna be able to do that. – You can listen to that episode of his podcast. – Yeah, it turns out that injecting these stem cells both intravenously but also directly into the problem areas is having these incredible effects. Basically what they’re seeing is that young stem cells that generate, basically secrete things that then cause the cells in older people’s bodies to behave like young cells and to basically things start happening differently. Like, there’s things that, you can look at a cell and you can see the mitochondria you can see these other things in it you can know, if you know anything about cells, cell biology that oh this is an old cell and this is a new cell. New cells multiply very quickly and they’re healthy in all the different parts but as we age, everything becomes less efficient and that’s why you don’t heal as quickly and you don’t repair yourself and eventually, you’re just basically slowly dying. Like once you hit adulthood you’re basically just slowly dying. Mesenchymal. – Mesenchymal stem cells. Which are not embryonic stem cells. – Right. Again, and that’s one of the things we’ll say that, that stem cells were super controversial probably continue to be super controversial especially in the United States because the impression was that these were embryonic and they were like taking babies. That’s not at all what this is, that’s not what’s happening. I don’t exactly know the science behind it but it isn’t that kind of thing. Some of them are from the umbilical cord that is donated, but they can also get some cells from your own body and anyway. It’s not actually a controversial thing it just kind of feels that way. Anyway, what is happening with this with the way that it’s like, ultimately it’s like, Mel Gibson’s dad was 92 had all these issues, he’s 100 now and he’s as healthy as he’s ever been. They’re reversing heart disease, they’re healing people who have spinal cord injuries, this is not pseudo-science this is not like anecdotal evidence that you see in some wack commercial, no. This is documented peer-reviewed stuff that is happening where people– – Even though we are only repeating the anecdotal evidence. – No, no. But the doctor was not, that wasn’t anecdotal. – Okay, that’s true. – That’s well documented, multiple sources it’s been done multiple times. Like, people who, like the story of a guy who was in a car wreck and could not walk had no sensation under, you know below the vertebrae that the spinal cord injury was. Now the dude walks around, he’s fine, he walks around he has full mobility, full functionality of his everything below the belt and he can walk, he can run, he can do anything. It’s because of these freaking stem cells that are repairing tissue in a way that it was not possible before this. – That conversation definitely had this futuristic magical ring to it that’s like wow this is what it’s gonna be like. I mean, this is gonna be such a commonplace treatment a decade from now. It felt like the way that people were talking about cryogenics, you know, years ago. Talking about Joe DiMaggio freezing himself or something like that. – Walt Disney. – Walt Disney, which that’s a myth. He did not freeze himself. I believe they said that Michael Jackson had a chamber before he died. – But let’s just say– – It feels the same as cryogenics but it’s much more rooted in promising science. – Without getting into the, I don’t wanna bore you guys I know some of you guys when we talk about certain scientific concepts are like well I don’t wanna hear about this. I don’t wanna talk about that the whole time and obviously we don’t know that much about it we just listened to the podcast and I’ve read a couple of books. But let’s just assume that things will continue as they have been and this technology you know, coupled with CRISPR and these other things that are going to continue to happen and develop. – Yeah you can just, so your lifestyle would be you just get an injection or you’ll hook up like you’ll charge your car, you’ll go through your portal into your living room and sit in your recliner and then you’ll hook up to your IVs of the stem cells and you’ll just get youthized. Not euthanized, totally different thing. – Yeah, for all intents and purposes. Again, I don’t know when this will happen but let’s just assume that there will be a point in which we can continue human life indefinitely, okay? Now interesting book, I told you guys I’ve raved about the book Sapiens. Well the same guy wrote Homo Deus which is a follow-up to Sapiens which is basically looking forward into the future just started this book, I’m a few chapters in. But he talks about this, this issue the idea of we’re all kind of trying to become immortal that’s what all this technology is kind of looking towards and he talks about the idea of how we, mortals, take risks, right? It’s like, we go surfing which is not even that risky but we might go skydiving or even ride in a car. We do things all the time that for certain moments the probability of us dying is greatly increased. – Yeah like shoot a confetti popper at your face point blank range. – And we do these things knowing that well I’m gonna die someday I mean you don’t think about it like that but we live in a culture where we know that we’ve got 70, 80, 90 years then it’s over. Well, his point was if we get to a place where you can sustain human life indefinitely people are gonna become very, very different. They’re gonna look at risk a lot differently. Like man, I could get 500 years on this planet I shouldn’t go sky diving because I could be losing– – So much. – 300 years as opposed to, well I’m gonna die in 40 years anyway. – But then you’ve got, like, what Hollywood has taught us about the vampire demeanor. – It’s sad and lonely? – It’s nihilist and defeated. I mean it’s like, they’re just grumpy. When you live that long and you encounter well first of all, they’re encountering a lot of people who aren’t living that long so they are lonely in that sense, but they’re grumpy. – Well also, they can only come out at night and they have to kill people to live. There’s a lot of negatives of being a vampire that’s why I’m never gonna be one. – Yeah, that’s a problem. – I mean, of course I don’t really have any control over that, I could get bit. But let’s just say that it is gonna happen. I mean, it is interesting to think are we gonna qualify? I mean, I was actually at the treadmill at the gym the other day and I had been listening to this book and I was working out and I was like you know, I have to put the information into the treadmill so I can get my heart rate and all this. – [Link] Yeah. – Now, the first week I went to the gym it was like weight, I was like 205, age, 40. – Ouch. – Yeah it hurt. – Two strikes. – Yeah had to type that in there. Without even thinking about it I’ve been reading this book. – Third strike would be, likes easy listening music. – That’s not an option on the treadmill. – Okay good. Enjoys soft rock. – No it’s really just your age and your weight. – Okay. – You know what I put in I didn’t even make this connection until right now. You know what age I put in this week on the treadmill? – You put in a different age, first of all? – I put in 25. – Are you, what? – Now, the reason I did it is because if you put in 25 the target heart rate goes up significantly so you have to work harder so I was like if I’m here, I need to work harder. But I was also thinking, I also need to work harder like I’m a 25-year-old because– – Well. – If I’m gonna live. – 25-year-old treadmill might kill a 40-year-old man. – No I held on, I was sweating a whole lot more I did realize that a 40-year-old trying to be a 25-year-old on a treadmill is much uglier to watch than a 40-year-old just being a 40-year-old. The first week, it’s just a 40-year-old on a 40-year-old treadmill and I’m sweating a little bit then I’m getting off. A 40-year-old on a 25-year-old system I was like, sweating and making noise. I had my headphones on listening to music. – You could feel that you were making noise? – 17 minutes into it I realized you’re breathing, like, really loud. But then I looked around and everyone else was on headphones and they’re all breathing and farting and stuff nobody is listening to each other. – Breathing and farting, that’s the cycle of life. – But I just realized now that what I’ve been thinking about is well maybe this is gonna happen maybe there will come this time when we solve the deepest mysteries of human longevity. Are we gonna be young enough where we can somehow be across the threshold and be taken on into the future? Then I started thinking, do I even want that? Do I wanna be a vampire? Do I wanna live to be 500 or is 80, 90 years is that the right time to live and then just be done? – Then you slowed that treadmill down to 40 again? – No I’m staying on 25 because I wanna be healthy and try to get my heart in shape. – Did you bring a coat to the gym? – No I don’t do that. I don’t take a coat to the gym. – Okay, whatever, okay. – But if I do I will wear it inside out. – Well that was good, that was my only follow-up question. – Do you wanna live forever and if you do live forever what happens, man? I mean we did our 200 year plan as exercise and entertainment, you know? Back on GMM but you’re talking about switching careers. – Well I think, I mean. I do think exploring Ali’s original question philosophically will kind of get at the same thing because that is, the implication there was at what point would you wanna be frozen so that when you woke up you could live from that point forward and maybe retain like, we’re 40, well I’m not 40, I am 39. – Oh, round up sucker. – You know, her question was, how much longer do we want our bodies to deteriorate before we have the chance of drastically slowing that down at some point in the future if that can happen, you know? Do you wanna live forever at just degrading a lot slower? I guess so. I mean it’s the same experience except like for every one day we get now, you get three. I think that seems like an easy yes for me. – But if there was a time in which you were gonna be frozen let’s just say that this would work. I think the question is, what age will you have lived enough of the life on this side is it, you get to be 70 and it’s just like, okay well is it, you get to be 80? When does life become more of a burden to live and this is different for different people. But for some people, things get really, really difficult past a certain age. – [Link] Right. – Would you wanna be frozen before that point? – I think the point, here’s the thing. I’ve got Christy who I would she would have to be frozen with me think you, I’d want you to be frozen with me then you’d want Jessie to be frozen with you then maybe, you know, we don’t want our kids to be frozen so we gotta wait for our kids to develop lives of their own and then we reach a certain level of pride in knowing that they’re achieving happiness in life and that they’ve, you know, they’ve got their own lives now. So obviously we’re not gonna freeze ourselves and just let our kids go through grade school, high school, college without us. Peace out kids! – Yeah but if you wait until you’re old the kids have already lived their lives you’re probably a grandfather, they’re adults. – No but there’s no point, I mean when you start to think about that it’s like okay then my kids are on their own. – Now you got grandkids. – Well no, the kids are on their own, you know? When do they start making a family of their own. You wanna see that, you wanna spectate that from the stand, you wanna be involved in that. There’s never a good time, for me with what’s happening in my life right now to pause it and say you know what? I’ll check back in 100 years from now when you can figure out how to drastically improve my quality of life from age 40 on. So then by the time, you know the people who wanna be frozen I think they’re either on their way out and it’s too late or you know, it’s just, their life’s not going well so they wanna, you know, hopefully wake up in an era when it can be better. – Well part of this question is you know I think the thing that we all fear is irrelevance, right? And I’m not talking about like, the irrelevance we fear as entertainers, you know? Nobody caring about what we have to say anymore. But just as a person. So this is the way our society works. You get to be a certain age and people just don’t care what you think anymore. They care about you, right? So you’ve got like, your grandparents you have three living grandparents, right? – Mm-hmm. – Lincoln is how old now? 80-something? – Eight? 88? – Now, you love him unconditionally, love him deeply but he’s an 88-year-old man. He has done the things that he is going to do. – Right. – He’s contributed 99% of things that he’s going to contribute, right? He’s comfortable with that, he’s fine with that. – Sure. – But at this point, like you don’t think of his opinion or his perspective it doesn’t carry the same weight that it carried when he was 58 and you were eight or whatever, right? – Right. – So there’s this point in which our society has just sort of said, you get to be this age and it’s just sort of like, you’re old now you matter but you don’t matter at the same time. That’s just this collective thing that people kind of do to old people. I think that personally, out of almost exclusively out of a sense of pride the idea of just not mattering of just being a person who is in the room at a family gathering and is like, sure we all love grandpa Rhett we all love him, but you know? Now we’re talking about things that really matter and at that point, he kind of checks out. I have a huge fear of that. Now, when I am 88, I’m not gonna care about that probably I care about that now as a 40-year-old ’cause I’m like, putting myself into the body of my 88-year-old self. – Yeah you’re having a mid-life crisis. – No it’s not a mid-life crisis it’s a fear of being old, it’s a fear of being irrelevant. A mid-life crisis is thinking that my life is over now. I love my life right now but I think that’s the part of getting old not even death, just getting old that we fear. So when I answer this question, I’m like well right when I feel like that’s about to happen when I’m about to become what I see as irrelevant that’s when I wanna check out. I feel bad even talking about it because I’m not trying to talk crap about old people. I’m just saying that this is just the way if you’re of a certain age, you can’t even get hired even if you’re capable. If you’re a white haired 70-year-old and you’re just as qualified as a brown haired 30-year-old you’d be like, this guy is 70, why does he wanna work here? You know, we don’t value we don’t feel like old people have anything to offer. I’m not saying it’s true, I’m just saying that’s just the way that. – Well when it is true, it’s a sad reality. – Right. – So summarize your point. – I’m just saying, to answer Ali’s question of when would I want to be cryogenically frozen if this was a legitimate thing because you were talking about I wanna spectate all these things, there’ll never be a point in which I don’t wanna be a part of my families life or whatever. I’m saying at the point that I become a burden is the point that I would wanna check out. – Then it’d be too late unless assuming that when they thaw you out in this thawed exercise that they can do something reversing which that, I think you can slow a lot but the whole reversing thing even the stem cell stuff we’re talking about I don’t know that it, it seems still like a leap to say that would make you young. It would make you the best of the age you could be. – Yeah, we’re assuming that you’re gonna basically be the same thing when you wake up and then you’re like well I was almost irrelevant when I was frozen and now you wake me up and I’m just irrelevant again. – You know what, it’s analogous, you know I don’t wanna go in another sci-fi direction but I am. It’s in a lot of ways analogous to who’s going to go colonize Mars? You know and you’re not gonna take your kids maybe you’d take your wife, depending on the criteria and how many people are going. I’m talking at first, at first they’re not taking a bunch of children to colonize Mars I would assume not. But so it’s people checking out of their Earth lives forever they’re never coming back, they’re gonna go to Mars and so they continue to live a life but you have to live a certain type of life or have a certain level of autonomy to be comfortable with, I’m gonna check out of this world and enter a new world. So I think there are people who are willing to do that. There are people that, you know I’m not one of those people, you know? When you’ve got kids that you’re investing in that’s a big factor. – Yeah I think we’re probably talking about single I mean the people who volunteer to do this and again, I’m kind of with Neil Degrasse Tyson on this I don’t understand why we’re thinking about colonizing Mars when we’ve got a planet that we really need to be worrying about here that’s actually habitable now but may not be for much longer if we don’t correct things. – Well I think we should have all the irons in the fire and we should have all types of people working on all types of things. – But let’s just say, we’re gonna talk about– – Enough brain power to go around. – Healthy 25-year-olds who are, you know single or going with their partner, don’t have children they’re saying bye to their parents maybe they don’t have a good relationship with their parents I mean you’re gonna have plenty of candidates I don’t think you have to worry about that. – Oh yeah, oh yeah. – But you know, it’s interesting because we’re talking about the ties that we have with our family and this is totally natural and I’m in complete agreement with you that as you think about your life and you think about what commitments you can make and you can’t make and how long you wanna live, when you wanna check out, when you wanna be frozen you’re thinking about it in the context as a husband and a father. – Mm-hmm. – It’s gonna be very interesting. I think that a lot of our commitments and the way that we see family is based on our life expectancy. Meaning that if we get to a place where we can live forever are you gonna be with the same person forever? Like, if you can ostensibly live to be 1,000 years old and your kids that you had your kids are gonna be 970 years old. You know what I’m saying? And they’re gonna have kids and they’re gonna have kids. The way that you– – There’s a space issue. – There’s definitely a space issue. – Like a capacity issue but let’s put that aside. – Let’s just theoretically say that they continue and maybe it’s not every 30 years maybe a generation becomes, you know 100 years or something like that. But you’re still talking about 10 generations of people. Are you gonna really care? Think about how many different think about the way that a family tree goes. You have two kids, they each have two kids they each have two kids, you go 10 generations we’re talking about hundreds of people who are related to you but because you’re so fricking old at a certain point, you’re gonna have no connection to them even though they are your direct descendants but now they’re contemporaries with you. – You have an embarrassment of riches of all these people that are related to you but it’s just, it’s like walking down the street and you’re like, odds are well you know, I wouldn’t be surprised given the odds, that this person. – And I wouldn’t care. – You couldn’t help but not care I think is your point. It’s an interesting point. – And listen, again, I’m not– – Because you can’t maintain meaningful relationships with that many people, it doesn’t matter what the blood connection is. – Right and I’m not trying to get myself in trouble I’m not trying to get you in trouble. I’m just talking theoretically here. – With our wives, you mean? – Yes. So let’s just say, let’s just say let’s not even talk about us. Let’s just talk about people who are in relationships in general. – Bobby. – Do you think– – And Jenny. – That if people can live forever and they get married in the first 30 years of their lives is that the expectation culturally now the cultural expectation, traditionally speaking is that you get married and you stay married then you die, right? ‘Til death do us part. Now, not everybody does that, there’s a lot of people get divorced for lots of different reasons. But the cultural sort of norm is that the expectation was that we’d be together forever even though half of couples don’t. – Are we about to undo everything we talked about in last weeks podcast? – No, no, no. See, no don’t think about it in respect to your wife. Think about it as– – Bobby and Jenny? – A cultural institution. There is absolutely no way that the expectation would remain that you would stay with the same person until you were 1,000. Because I believe that the expectation to stay ’til death do us part is based on life expectancy coming back to my original argument. If life expectancy isn’t a thing I just expect my life to go on forever there’s gonna become some norm and I think the norm will be based on being with somebody and producing another generation and when that generation is. – The same as you. – No, no. The moment in which you can no longer connect with the offspring, so you can connect with your grandkids ’cause that already happens. – Great grandkids. – You can connect with your great grandkids ’cause that already happens. There are some people who connect with their great, great grandkids. But I feel like great, great, great grandkids now you’re in a place where the emotional capacity for connection with great, great, great grandkids is so low, that’s when you say all right it’s been great, this has been an incredible relationship but now we’re gonna leave and we’re gonna do this again. – Well the thing I do agree with is that it becomes like a corporate relationship like you’re the CEO of a company. When a company gets so big, this does happen. The CEO of the company can’t have a meaningful work relationship with certain people down the business structure. I just think, you know, I don’t know you and I can be very heartless so I’m trying to channel that person who’s listening. – It’s not. – No, no, no. Well okay. – It’s not heartless. – No, no. Here’s what some people are saying right now I’m gonna try to channel it. That is, there are, fact, there are people out there who have the capacity to love nations of people in a way that like, we’re just not. – I love nations of people, I love all nations! – I love all nations, I love everybody! I’m just saying as a unit of measurement. There are people who, their love is unbounded. I just think that– – Well but we’re also. – But we’re talking very practically. Like, practical mechanics of actual connection there is a limitation to the human to a human’s ability to have a meaningful. You can have a love for a nation of people but you can’t have a connection you can’t have specific relationships with that many individuals. – Yeah well I think it’s 150, right? There’s a certain, I don’t know what the number is it’s the so-and-so number because some anthropologist determined that just based on 100 gatherer heritage that the human brain has the capacity to have meaningful relationships with like 150 individuals. It’s just based on, like, tribe size, whatever. I don’t wanna say, ’cause they’re also talking about it the way I broke it down was when you could no longer connect with offspring, but you might be saying but what about the partner that you’re with? Isn’t the love for your partner just going to continue indefinitely? I’m just saying that, the expectation for how long the relationship would be is that would actually take on a much more practical approach ’cause here’s the thing. We like to think that this is just the way it’s always been but the fact is, is that many different cultures and probably most the way that relationships were formed in the distant past was much different. In fact, humans were much more like animals in the distant past in that they were in polygamous relationships. I mean, when you go back to those 150 size tribes it was a dude with multiple wives you see that in all kinds of ancient text and there’s lots of archeological evidence of that. So that was the cultural norm at the time. So what I’m saying is that and the reason that it was that way is all kinds of factors that contributed to what was the most efficient way to live at the time for multiple women to pair up with one man. It was just the way that the dynamics worked. So I’m saying that in the distant future people are living forever, the dynamics, the expectations and the cultural norms and what we consider to be moral will change because it changes over time as circumstances change. I don’t think it’s gonna be this thing where it’s just like oh well that love isn’t real. It’s gonna be like no, that love was there for a certain time and then both people are just like okay, either we continue this or we don’t and it will be based on so many different factors that we can’t even begin. Like that goes back to the, when are you gonna wake up? When are you gonna be introduced? Which we talked about a couple of podcasts ago you might wake up at a time where so many things have changed and we’ve tapped into the way our brain works and we have no capacity to even understand the future that we’ve been put in. – Your mind explodes. – Then you’re like, I shouldn’t have woken up. Again, I agree with you, not trying to be bleak about it it’s just, it’s a reality. – But the thing about staying paired up for life even if that’s eternity and the argument of you know, 50 years together, 60 years together the type of thing of that seeming long and to be celebrated as a cultural achievement. I’m just wondering if you take it backwards to you know when life, based on life expectancy that’s what makes it awesome to say okay if we’re gonna live this long you’re gonna be partnered up for that long that’s to be celebrated. Well, let’s go back to life expectancy when life expectancy was much less. Being with somebody that long was, I’m sure still celebrated or maybe, would you say it was no big deal when people were dying of the Black Plague or whatever it was called? – Well you know, go ahead. – Because then I’m saying if you stay together as long as you live then relatively if you live for, if life expectancy is 250 years it seems like the same principals would apply. It doesn’t seem like that should change. The arguments that we were making on the previous podcast about how relationships, commitment in a loving partnership opens up a world of experience and enrichment that just moving to somebody else and starting over which might be more amorous you’re missing out on something. I’m trying to make the argument that if I had another 150 years in my relationship with my wonderful wife it would be that much more wonderful for ways that I could not anticipate because. – That’s not what I’m saying because you’re talking about life expectancy I’m talking about suspended, not suspended animation basically not aging anymore. So I’m talking about indefinite life. – Yeah I know but I’m incrementally getting there. So I’m just making an argument well let’s pull back to life expectancy 250 years. How do you feel about that? Well I feel like I could make that argument. Now 500 years. – Well okay but you’re also being a little unfair because you’re putting it in personal terms. Obviously if I put it in personal terms I’m going to say that if I were to live to be 1,000 I would stay with Jessie all 1,000 years. – Yeah and you know what? And we’ll cut it right there and what I said and what you just said is what we’ll send to them. (Rhett laughs) And now we can just talk, we can just let it out. – I’m not talking about it personally because my perspective that I bring to this and your perspective that you bring to this is a person who is gonna live to be no more than 100 if you’re lucky, and then you’re gonna die. You and I live in this time frame, we have this mindset, we have this perspective and so do our wives we live in a time that has this cultural expectation. – But let’s talk about 250 years. – You cannot talk about it personally. – let’s talk about 250 years. – And I’ll go right back to what I said. So 250 years, when do the great great grandkids come in? Definitely before 250 years. So I’m saying that that’s the trigger point and which point that the offspring that you create you would begin to lose an emotional connection with them? The offspring that you created with this individual person because ultimately, if you wanna get down to the mechanics that’s kind of the purpose, that’s sort of the ultimate biological purpose of pairing up in a traditional sense is to propagate the species, right? That’s what those desires that’s what they’re kinda based in. So if you put it into those terms. – You’re making an argument void of consciousness. – No I’m not. – I’m mean I’m sure a Bonobo would feel that way. – No, no ’cause you’re trying to argue from the perspective of someone who feels about things the way that we do. Again that’s why if you ask me personally I’ll say I don’t care how old I’m gonna get I’m gonna stay with my wife because that’s the mind frame. – But if we were born into a world where people paired up and it was celebrated to be in a committed propagating relationship. – I’m saying probably it wouldn’t be celebrated. – Even if you were with somebody – For a certain time. – For a certain amount of time and then it was expected. – To break up. – Once you hit the, what do we call it? – Let’s call it 250. – No, no but – The threshold. – Let’s name the threshold something that sounds cool that the culture can really get behind. – The love milestone. – The love milestone. – The love stone, there’s a whole ceremony there’s a stone and you rub it and all your friends come. All your offspring down to your great, great, great grandkids come your great, great, great, great grandkids don’t come because you don’t care about those stupid idiots. (Link laughs) There’s too many of them. You’ve got hundreds of people already showing up at this fricking thing. – If we were born into that cultural norm where that was celebrated and then at the love stone you part ways amicably or not. – No, no, you know what would happen at the love stone? First of all, it would be a cultural contract it would be a societal pact and what would happen at the love stone agreement is not only would you and it wouldn’t be seen as a break-up again, we see all these things in a negative light because of the time that we live in. If you could live to be whatever age and you got to the love stone. What would happen at the love stone ceremony is that the next two people that you are both going to pair off with would be at the love stone ceremony that’s what a love stone ceremony would be. It would be this couple is parting and starting two new couples. You’d still be friends, but now you start the whole process over again with someone else. It would be celebrated culturally. It’s counter to everything that we think. – But if that were the cultural norm that I was born into and experienced my whole life I could see that I would fall in line, you know? Because it’s just the way it is. You know, if you’re taught your whole life that this is the beauty of it and these are the ways to celebrate it, you know? I’m certain I could be convinced of it. – But then there would be a movie. There would be a movie and it would be a movie about it would be called Turning Over The Love Stone and it would be about this couple that got to the love stone ceremony and they had their new partners were there and they shunned the new partners and they started the whole thing over again together and that would become celebrated as the ideal because that was turning the cultural norm on its head and it would be seen as incredibly controversial. They moved past the love stone they’re actually talking to their great, great, great grandkids. That could also happen. – Yeah and I think there are many people that would wanna stay together. – And you and I are two of those people. – Absolutely. (Rhett laughs) – It seems like by saying that that we’re actually saying the opposite. – No, no, I told you! – And I’m not. – From a personal perspective. – You tricked me, by the way. You spent the last 15 minutes to get me on your side about this freaking love stone and then the moment I’m like, you know what? If I was born into this cultural norm and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah I could see that I would fall in line. The moment I said I would fall in line, you’re like (Rhett laughs) and then they’d make a movie and the awesome thing that I would agree with was someone turning over the love stone. – Yeah. – You trapped me, you jerk. – It’s the beauty of talking about things that will never come to passing in our lifetime. It’s totally fictitious, man! – You know what could never come to pass? The release of this podcast. We can’t release this. – Yes we can. Now, again. – This has cultural implications in my household ’cause you tricked me. – Okay so what you’re telling me is that just because if your wife finds out that you said that if it was (chuckles) culturally acceptable for you to only be married to her for like 300 years (chuckles) that you might call it quits after 300 years. You think she’s gonna be upset about that? – Well I wouldn’t call it quits, I’d call it the love stone. – Yeah, the love stone, it’s all positive. You gotta say, listen, baby we’re talking about a fictitious reality that we started talking about based on Ali Bee’s question that led us to a place where we talked about a time when humans can live indefinitely where once you get to having great, great, great grandkids you have no more capacity to love. (laughing) So there’s this ceremony called the love stone where you get a new partner. – You know what she would say? – What would she say? – I told you years ago to get out from under that tall guy’s thoughts. – What? You act like this is my fault, this isn’t my fault. I’m just speaking what I believe what I’m talking about is not what I want but what I guess would be the truth if this were to come to pass. That’s all I’m saying. I say, my personal application is together forever. My best guess as to what would be the cultural norm is that it would change because together forever is based on forever not being that long. But when forever becomes forever, forever. – Forever, ever? – Everything we think about commitment will change. I think that’s gonna be one of the most significant cultural questions that has to be answered if and when we reach true immortality which I don’t necessarily think is ever gonna happen and I definitely don’t think we’re gonna live to see it and I don’t even think that I would want to to be completely honest with you because I think at some point I’m just gonna be ready to check out. Even if I do have this amazing 40-year-old body that runs on a 25-year-od treadmill. – Listen, you can’t stroll the grocery aisles forever. At some point, you’re right, you gotta check out. (Rhett chuckles) I mean think about it, that’s a good analogy. – Yep. – I mean, I’ve been in a grocery store. The last thing I wanted was to stay there forever. – Yeah but you can go to like, a super Walmart. They got more stuff. – It’s kind of a trashy feeling though. – I mean you could go to, there’s so many stores though. – What do you mean? In my analogy, there’s only one store. (Rhett chuckles) – The store is not your wife, right? (chuckles) – She has everything I need. – Because that wasn’t what I was saying. I moved beyond that. I’m gonna be in the Superbowl Mart for the rest of my life. (laughing) – Man, usually at this point I’m like all right you let us know what you think #EarBiscuits but you’re not gonna listen to this because this has been, this has been censored. – Well here’s the thing is that you’re making the assumption that our wives listen to this podcast, they don’t. – No they don’t. – They don’t, they listen to us. – That’s why you’re listening to this. – Blabber on about things at home. Why are they gonna choose to play a digital file of us talking for an hour? – Let’s be real, real, all right? – Yeah. – Who are we, to think that they would be offended that we would say that? They’d probably be like Hale-freaking-lulijah. You think I wanna be with you forever? I know one of our wives is gonna be thinking that. – I know, I think my wife would I think she’d be on the same page with me. I think she would say, if that comes to pass the love stone ceremony hundreds of years into the future I get it, it’s fine, wish you the best. – You know what? Well you know, we can re-stone. – Yeah you can come back again. – Yeah. – Yeah. – You have forever! – You have forever, unless you die in a car wreck. – Oh that’s a good point. – Yeah, which is one of the things I was talking about earlier but you know let’s just assume that you’re living in like a weird bubble suit that you can’t die. Which that makes things awkward right there. Bubble suit. – I just picture myself walking down the grocery store aisle in a bubble suit. (Rhett laughing) How do I get out of this place? – You can’t, you can’t die, you’re in a bubble suit. – Can’t fit through the checkout, all those magazines. – Okay, well, Abi or, that’s not your name, Ali Bee. – You’ve really dredged it up. – Yeah, I mean this is all your fault but you know, hopefully many, many years from now somebody at a love stone ceremony will dig this up and be like, you know the origin of this whole idea? Couple of nimrods back in 2018 talking out of their butt holes. (laughing) #EarBiscuits – [Rhett] Breathe in deep. To hear this Ear Biscuit in its entirety and make sure you don’t miss an episode follow the links in the description to subscribe on Apple Podcasts or anywhere else podcasts are available. – [Link] To watch more Ear Biscuits click on the playlist on the right. – [Rhett] To watch more of our daily show Good Mythical Morning click the playlist on the left. – [Link] And don’t forget to click the circular icon to subscribe. – [Rhett] Thanks for being your mythical best.