I’m Jake Johnson, and my last meal would be a vegan Chicago diner style cheeseburger with fries and a homemade Coke. A New Orleans style shrimp po boy sandwich, omakase sushi, and a vegan hot fudge sundae for dessert. ((Intro Music)) Every person has exactly two things in common. We all gotta eat and we’re all gonna die. Today we’re joined by writer, actor, and prolific neon sign hanger, you might recognize him as Nick Miller from New Girl, Jake Johnson, welcome to the show man. A nice shout out for the neon signs. I’m proud of the work that you’ve done in your career. Thank you. On camera and off camera. Thank you, thank you. So, you’ve recently made your directorial debut with Self Reliance. My first question, how did it feel to get manhandled by Boban Marjanović’s gigantic catcher’s mitts? You know, it’s a really good question. Way more intense than I expected. Yeah. So, Boban, who is actually who I thought of for the part, I kind of wrote it with him in mind. – [Josh] No way. And then, when we started casting, I reached out to him, I think through Instagram. And on set, we were talking about the stunt, and I was like, so you just kind of push me like this, and he’s a gentle guy. Yeah. But he’s, you know, I think he’s 7’7 And a professional athlete. That’s too tall for a human, in my opinion. Massive. Massive guy. And then, you know, we’re doing the thing, and he’s got to push me against the wall and throw me down. And his hands hit me and I hit the wall and it was a shock and I had to do a thing where I was like I got the protection on the back after everything changed because I’m like he’s going at 10 percent speed. – [Josh] Yeah. This is a giant, and he’s very strong, and I physically can’t handle this, man. If you ever had NBA dreams before Self Reliance, I don’t know if they’re gonna be fulfilled now. I think when I realized 5’10 was the max, I was like, this is just not the game for me. We’re eating your last meal today. Is that something you’ve ever thought about before? I just remember the end of life and watching my old man go through it. The last thoughts would be like, you know what I’m thinking? Applebee’s! Something delicious to put in this failing meat sack. It’s like, how about some like, ice and maybe a popsicle? So mine, the turn of it, the vegan of it all, is, I didn’t realize but, you know, I was doing press for Let’s Be Cops with Damon Wayans Jr. And then we were flying from Arizona and I woke up and I had, what looked like bed bug bites all over my body. And Damon called me out, he’s like, he’s like bedbugs, 100%. Nicky Thomas, the writer, was like, man, you are like infected, it’s disgusting. So I sat on the plane, I kept apart from them, we got home, my wife met me in the, in the driveway, I ripped off my clothes in the driveway in Los Feliz, Threw everything in the garbage, threw my luggage away. She gave me some clothes, we went to the urgent care, And I go, I got bedbugs, what should I do? And he goes, that’s not bedbugs, it’s an allergy. And they tested and they found out it was a dairy allergy and my body was reacting to that and the pizza and it was a wheat allergy and it was like created this whole world of change. Wow. But what happened was I fell in love with vegan style Chicago food. Because I’d be like, vegan pizza’s still good. It’s just a change. ((Bells Ringing)) – [Josh] Alright Jake, for course number one we have the vegan double cheeseburger a la Chicago Diner. We got some ketchup, mustard, pickles. You got grilled onions on yours. We have some fresh homemade fries right here. And then we have, I’m gonna, you requested, the official language was, can the Coke be some healthier version with no sugar or terrible chemicals? So that is exactly what we made. We’re calling this Let’s Be Coke as an homage to Let’s Be Cops. I like it. – [Josh] We have made a homemade, sugar free Coke. A little bit of balsamic vinegar, some Chinese cinnamon in there, a lot of clove, about 12 to 13 different aromatics, lemon zest, lime zest. We’ve done the whole thing. We carbonated and bottled it ourselves. What a blast. Thank you. And it might taste somewhat like Coke. We’ll see. We’ll see. Well, cheers. Cheers, man. – [Jake] Definitely got the setup of it. ((Music)) It doesn’t taste like Coke. Doesn’t taste like Coke. But! Well, it’s not Coke. It’s Let’s Be Coke. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It’s willing itself to be coke. I don’t know what that is. I’m sorry. You said make Coke without. – [Jake] Yeah, yeah, yeah. Coke is the terrible chemical. – [Jake] Agreed. Agreed. I’m gonna say I like it. I think we can still salvage this relationship if we just, like, give each other a little bit of grace throughout this, you know? Now I get the premise. But tell me about the, the double cheeseburger and why this means a lot to you. Growing up in Chicago, kinda every meal, at least for me, was a cheeseburger and fries. I grew up across the street from a McDonald’s. And so, I went there so often that I knew everybody who worked there. I used to, when I was like in fourth grade, I used to play basketball with the workers on their break. Oh, hell yeah. We all used to go to Sacred Heart Church and play basketball at the outdoor gym. And I didn’t realize until my twenties that a cheeseburger and fries and a Coke wasn’t healthy. Yeah. – [Jake] I just thought that was food. Sure. And the game has changed. These Impossible Burgers are good now. – [Josh] They are. And so, yeah, that’s why this is. And every kind of, my mother and I growing up, she owned a junk shop. And so a lot of that is you’re going to different neighborhoods in the city, you’re negotiating, you’re trying to make deals. And Chicago diners used to be everywhere. So, in the 80s, in every corner was a dive bar and a diner. And so going in there, you knew the cheeseburger was gonna be good. The cheeseburger’s the universal food language. The best. – [Josh] Yeah, well, dig in, man. Let’s do it. I hope I hate it. I hope you do too. I hope you hate everything. I hope there’s a turn. I love that. We’re gonna end this interview in the next, like, 20 minutes. We’re just gonna scream the name of your movie. I’m just going like, I’m like, what the fuck? You said this was a great show. What are we talking about here? Tell your friends. Excellent. It’s pretty great though, right? It’s pretty great, man. One of the funnier things about the Impossible and Beyond patties, they taste almost more like fast food burgers than actual meat does. I agree with you. In Self Reliance, a big theme in the movie is this need for almost just rote human connection. It’s not even like a specific kind of human connection, it’s just any human connection. Yes. How did the pandemic affect your own relationship with understanding your need for that? I was writing a movie with my buddy Joe Swanberg, which was going to, gonna be in Chicago about these new, these, you know, morning news people and a guy basically has a nervous breakdown on air, blah, blah, blah. And I was starting to write it and I thought like, we’re in a pandemic, I’m not gonna make this. Yeah. I’m just writing this for no one and for nothing. And I thought, if I’m still gonna put these hours into writing, I wanna write the dream project. And Self Reliance for me is the dream project. I was just doing an, event for Spider-Verse last night and I was with Jason Schwartzman. And we were talking and he said like, are you gonna make another one? And honestly, I was kind of like, no, I wanted to make this one. -[Josh] Yeah. Yeah. And this is how I wanted it to be. So I’m like, in terms of the pandemic and the being away from people, I really missed everything. I miss the little interactions you have throughout the day that you take for granted. Comedically, that’s why I got into this game. I’ll give anything for the annoying waiter, or the annoying waitress. I miss those bits. And so, I started going back to this movie and then, kind of, that’s what happened. Yeah, those little annoying moments in life, as somebody who goes to a public gym, you encounter them constantly, but I love them, I crave them every single day, cause it just, it makes you feel something, and that’s better than nothing. That’s exactly right. And Natalie Morales in the movie has a line where she says, you were so afraid of feeling that you were already dead. Yeah, yeah. That line meant a lot to me. Are you somebody who has gone through life feeling that numbness, feeling like you’re already dead in a way? I have gone through life for a long time, with the desire not to feel stuff, thinking that that was the goal. And the goal was, was you pushed through anything, and the idea of getting through stuff was the win. And I used to do a thing that my wife teases me about, where she would go like, how you doing? And my answer would always be, how am I supposed to know? Fair, honestly. Because you’re like, oh, I’m just doing the shit. I’m doing the stuff. Yeah. Like, how am I feeling felt so irrelevant when I was growing up. And then culturally there was a change, and people’s feelings from the younger generation seemed to really matter. Yeah. And people of my generation, myself included, thought like, what? And then it started making me ask the questions of like, well, how am I feeling? And then I realized, like, I have no idea. Yeah. And then I’ve been changing into going more like, oh, you’re supposed to try to feel everything while we’re here. – [Josh] Yeah. And so that was the kind of, Tommy’s character wasn’t feeling it. And this game made him go. Even though it was scary and all this, he was at least alive and experiencing it. So, I mean, it seems like part of, part of Self Reliance it’s like an obvious critique of the dystopian reality TV show era. But do you think that everything is just cyclical and ultimately the cream rises to the top? The strike reminded me of like, oh yeah, like, we don’t have to play by these old corporation rules. We are just going direct to the audience. And going direct to consumer. And if you have that relationship, and you’re able to make stuff that people like, and you like making it. I’m like, man, isn’t it nice not to do 40 meetings? Isn’t this great? And so that’s where my optimism kind of reads. I started up doing, when I came up, it was all theater. So everything was writing stuff ourselves, putting it on. We would rent theater spaces in New York. My buddy Oliver Ralli and I, you had a two man show for years, and we would rent a theater for $200 and hand out flyers in Times Square and try to get people to come and perform directly for people. And they either laughed or they didn’t laugh, and that immediacy and that connection was so exciting and has been lost for me in the last, you know, 15 years of my career. Would you say that you’re having more fun in your career now? Maybe not at the beginning when you were with Ralli, you know, doing that, but at least more than like 10 years ago? Like has that reignited a sense of fun and passion? Yes. But it’s different fun, because that was so fun because it was the childhood dream. – Yeah. – So, New Girl was so fun. Let’s Be Cops was so fun. Jurassic World, all that era was so fun, because I couldn’t believe it was real life. I couldn’t believe I was on like a soundstage, and we were doing this thing, and doing table reads, and the president of the network was there, and we’re all, and I’m like, whoa! And then guest stars coming in where you’re like, you’re now gonna go do a scene with Rob Reiner, and I’m like, what is happening? So that world was really fun. But this world right now feels, I don’t know, it’s more, I do feel more excited. I do feel more into it. And I have been getting, the last few years, less and less passionate about the game. And more and more passionate about, like, life and other things. But it’s sad because this is my hobby. And your hobby is your passion. So, I’m like I’m not gonna like get into fishing My body is too weird to get like into racecar driving So I’m like what am I gonna do for the next 10 years? 5’10 isn’t that short? I mean basketball, you can play point guard, you can play point guard. I got a heavy bottom. ((Laughing)) This frame doesn’t work in a tight car, trust me. It’s gross. Getting in and out is gross. ((Bells Ringing)) – [Josh] Jake, course number two, we have a New Orleans style fried shrimp po boy. – [Jake] Looks great. – [Josh] Yeah, on a classic New Orleans roll. A little bit of remoulade on there, lettuce, tomato, lemon on the side if you want it. Man, what’s the story? What’s your connection to New Orleans? You know, I did, 21 Jump Street. I was there for three and a half weeks to film two scenes. And, that’s how I got to know Rob Riggle. He became my kind of buddy down there. But, what we would do on our days off is we would go to the Harrah’s Casino and gamble. Nice. – [Jake] Have some drinks, and then eat local food. And I’d never had a real po boy before. And having it down there, I was like, oh, everything changed. Oh yeah, it’s a different game, man. It’s excellence. So that was it. – [Josh] Please man, dig in. That’s perfect. – [Josh] God damn, that’s really good. You made a movie called Win It All about gambling, so it was sort of the addiction to losing. You also, were a professional blackjack player, but not in the way you’d expect. Yeah. I worked at a casino down in Inglewood, which is now SoFi Stadium, I think. But what have you learned about life from gambling? A lot. My mother used to be a professional player. Oh, wow. She used to play poker, but what I’ve learned about, first of all, working in casinos and gambling there, and the reason I wanted to make Win It All, was a lot of gamblers are just doing it to lose. The thing that I learned is, that’s what I had, and I realized it were, I was playing poker one night, I was down at the Commerce, about 3 A.M. on like a Tuesday, this was pre my kids being born when I could still do that stuff, so fun, so fun, crazy fun. And I was playing, I was playing, I was playing, and there was some guy at the table who was older and he played, he played a shitty hand. He shouldn’t have done what he was doing. And he ended up sucking me out and I lost and I was, I was yelling at him and I was like yelling at him of why he played that way. And then I realized it was like a pretty empty casino and I was the guy yelling where everybody was looking and then I walked to an empty table. And my ATM had been cashed out, not in total, but I just couldn’t take out any more funds that night. Yeah. And I was at zero, I had just blown up at like, an old man. Which does not feel great. No, no, that’s one of the things in life you try and avoid. You really feel like a, you know, not a great human. And then I sat there and I thought like, it was almost this sense of calm where I was like, now I can go home. And I was like, that shit’s dark. You know, when I look at other aspects of my life, I’m like, well I don’t want to play to lose. I don’t want the story to be, I lost but it was over. – [Josh] Yeah. So even going to like this hobby or this business, you can play this game to lose and you watch people do it all the time. And what I really learned from gambling is, it’s so much better to win. Just win quietly and relax. You don’t have to win it all, you don’t have to be the top. But just like, get your win, enjoy playing, and go home. It’s so funny, because anything you’ve said in any interview about the idea of success, it, I can’t tell if it is the most sane view of success, or the most insane view. That’s fair. No, but I mean, it’s like you’ve fully gone clear, like you’re almost past it. It seems like most people get into acting to try and become rich and famous, whereas you tried to get just rich and famous enough to continue acting. I think that’s right. Well, more than just acting. Continue doing what I like. If you’re gambling and you don’t have enough chips, the only way to get your chips is you have to go all in. You have to really gamble on hands that are not good enough to go all in. So if we’re playing against each other, and you have all the money and I have less, and I have a medium hand, I have to act like I’m strong. As an actor, as a writer, as a director, if you don’t have any money and you have to pay your rent, you’re desperate and you will do anything for that win. You’re not doing the stuff that you’re supposed to be doing. So once I started making money as if those were my chips, I felt like I just need enough so I don’t have to play desperate. I don’t have to chase. I could play the hands that I want to play the way that I want to play them. And that means if I think I’m beat. And everybody else thinks I’m winning. I can just fold. And people go like, well that was a stupid fold. And I go, I know, but I think I was beat. And so there’s certain career paths. And you would know better than you if you’re beat. That’s exactly. And even if I’m not, if it’s TV and underneath, you see the camera and you bluffed me, God bless you, man. You won that hand. I’m not that worried about this hand. I want to keep playing. I don’t have a, creative North Star anymore. There used to always be one. So I think the goal is, is do what you like to do. Hopefully have an audience that’ll come with you and do it for as long as you can or until you want to stop. I saw on New Girl you talked about having hacky guest directors come in and give hacky notes to people because they weren’t sort of part of the family. Yeah. did you ever find yourself giving those hacky notes? What I hate about television is you have your same crew, your same people, your same vibe. You guys do it every day. You know each other. You know where people shine, you know, when you know when someone’s in a bad mood the second you see them. Every week there’s a new visitor. Who’s the boss. It drove me nuts, now certain directors come in and they just have this wild skill. They just fit right in and help. While, other directors come in and would go like, you guys doing the table here? Yeah, we’re gonna shoot that way. And you go, no, we always shoot this way. And they go, that’s prettier and then the crew starts moving in that direction and you go, this is where we always shoot, like, for example, on the couch of that, on that show in the living room, there’s like a place where the legs would go up. And on the pilot, I claimed it. We’re shooting long hours. We’re shooting long hours. And so in rehearsal, little actors tip, when they say, like, let the actors do what they want, find a comfortable spot if you’re gonna shoot long. So Max was running around, you know, doing his thing. Lamorne was, like, politely sitting. Zooey’s on, like, she’s got to stand up because she had a monologue. And so, I sat down in a spot with my legs up and then I think my character would be drinking a soda water. Right? Gotta have something to drink. – [Josh] Sure. So, I ended up sitting there so much over the years that on the couch there was a crease where my butt cheeks were. Unreal. For real. You can track the way your body changed based on the indent. Not great. ((Laughing)) And so, the long story short of it is we would all of a sudden be there, we’d get to our spots, we’d all be talking, the operators, everybody knew each other so well. So we’re going over the scenes, Zooey’s saying I might do this, I mean, you’re doing the shorthand, you’re figuring it out. The director would come and go like, alright, Max, you sit here. And I’m like, on my butt groove? ((Laughing)) No way, my guy. Just cause you have visitation rights doesn’t make you my dad. Exactly right! You’re just Steve, okay? My dad loves me! ((Bells Ringing)) You ever had a sushi chef with pigtails and pink nails? No! Well, welcome to Mythical Kitchen! Say it on the goddamn! – [Nicole] I’m going to. Run it back! Roll, roll! You fools! This is my first time! Everybody shut the [BLEEP] up! ((Laughing)) All right, Jake, for course number three. Great laugh! Thanks so much, you gotta start with a laugh. That’s how people know you’re having fun. Hi, I’m Nicole, and I’m gonna be guiding Too soon, Nicole! Come in quicker, he said faster, that’s the only director’s note he knows! Faster! Okay, we’re gonna run it back, and we’re gonna need somebody to count me in. Three, two. Oh my god, Jake. Course number three, we have omakase sushi. Hi guys, my name is Nicole, I’m going to be your chef. You’re rushing now, she’s rushing now, she’s rushing. Slow down, it’s not a race. Just be yourself. Okay. Let’s see what we got. – [Nicole] Okay. Hi, my name is Nicole, I’m going to be your sushi chef for the evening. And enjoy what I’m gonna do. It’s gonna be really good. That’s pretty good. – [Nicole] It’s gonna be really good. I think she nailed that line. Enjoy what I’m gonna do is a little weird. I don’t know, I was really feeling it. It’s honestly really natural. I don’t know what you’re talking about. Yeah, something. I don’t know what you’re talking about. I’m into it. Why did you request an omakase sushi service from a YouTube show? Because Gillian said pick your last meal. That’s fair. And I thought like, I don’t know. I like when I, you know, I’ve got a funny story about this where, I just went to Austin, for Minx at the, ATX Festival. We went to a omakase sushi place, and I was gonna take Ophelia, and it was gonna be the two of us. I didn’t know what the spot was like, I just knew it was like a speakeasy vibe. She texted, still on the plane, not gonna make it. And I thought like, well, I’d already paid for two and you can’t cancel. So I’m like, I don’t think I can go alone. That’s a little bit sad. And then David Walton, he was the best. And we were old buddies. He texted. Are you here in Austin? Because I am. I think we’re in the same hotel. Let’s party. And I go, do you want to go on a really romantic sushi date with me? And he said yes, so it was me, him, and then like three other couples. And we sat and we all got drunk together. It was like an anniversary, you know. They’re about to have a baby, another couple, and then me and him. – [Josh] Just guys being dudes. Just two dudes. And it ended up being like a total blast, and that chef would sell each meal of what it was. Of what each cut of piece of fish was, and I was like, what a blast. So that happened right as, she was texting about this. Love that. Nicole, please. All right, gentlemen, we have for you amberjack with yuzu and imported Japanese salt. – [Jake] Delicious. – [Josh] Thank you so much, Chef Nicole. Chef Nicole, where did you train in Japan? Like in the south. Get this [BLEEP] pieces of fish out of here! ((Laughing)) Oh yeah. In the south? Well that sounds lovely, I hear they have great fish down there. – [Josh] Some of the best I’ve heard. That’s what I hear. I mean, the sushi is really nice. – [Jake] Very good. Don’t talk with your mouth full, please, that’s rude. She’s right. ((Laughing)) I gotta tell you, they’re tough down in the south of Japan. Yeah. But they’re the best. We used to have a northern sushi chef here, fired him, on the spot. Too easy. – [Josh] Got too easy. Guests were too comfortable. Yeah. Tough southern Japanese lady. Easy! – [Josh] In between, of course. Take it easy back there. Jake, I don’t know if you know this, you have a podcast. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That’s pretty crazy, right? You have a podcast with your friend Gareth Reynolds, called We’re Here to Help. – [Jake] Yeah. So, we have had our coworkers write in advice. We’re gonna do some little rapid fire advice sessions. I’ll read off scenarios. So I’m gonna tell you how the show actually works and why I can’t do these. – [Josh] Go ahead. Because the caller becomes our story engine. Yeah. So when they call in, we get to ask them questions and get deeper into their life. And then the whole bit of it is going back to Chicago bar vibe. – [Josh] Yeah. We’re not therapists, we’re not pretending to be, we’re not experts. But if you go to that bar in Chicago you were saying you go there and you’re getting drunk, you can find some random person at the bar and if you tell them your problems, they’ll try to pitch solutions. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That’s the premise of the show. – [Nicole] So this is torched salmon with yuzu kosho and homemade shoyu. Enjoy. It’s lovely. In your second episode titled The Santa Dilemma, you gave advice to somebody who gave a gift to their boss that went unacknowledged. Do you remember what that gift was? This was the, ostrich farm. That’s correct. What if I told you that the ostrich farm tickets were gifted from somebody in this company to this company, and we have them. Wait. Here, can we please send in. You’re the guy? – [Chris] Yeah. ((Applause)) – [Jake] Wow, this is a great bit. Is it really you? Yes. Why the [BLEEP] did you give that gift? And who’s the boss? I thought you were on our side. I was the caller. Wait, hold on. This is excellent. On the show, you gave a great thing. So you gave your boss, here. Yes. Who’s the boss? Not me, a guy named Link. By the way, we’re here to help. Listen to episode two, right now. Then come back to this so I don’t have to do the explanation. Alright, so then, the way it ended that we, I remember. Cheers. Cheers. Good to see you all again. ((Laughing)) This is a wild turn. The way that it ended, that I remember, is you put the tickets on your boss’s desk. Yes. He did not respond. No. And they sat there for weeks. So you don’t know what happened? – [Chris] On his desk. No! What are you doing? This guy, this guy gave his boss, the boss has. It’s also my boss. Okay, great. It’s everybody’s boss. Everybody’s boss, yes. By the way, what’s his vibe? Or you have to say nice? Yeah, he’s quirky. Okay, quirky. Quirky is good. Quirky is good. But he gave, what’s the guy’s name again? Link? Four tickets to an ostrich farm in Solvang, which is a two and a half hour drive. That’s deep. Three and a half from where Link lives. Yeah, so a three hour drive to take his wife and his children, who are, we found out, in their twenties or teenagers. Around there, yeah. Adults. Definitely adults, yeah. I just got spooked someone was behind me! The production assistants are always around, man. – [Jake] Yes, exactly! Now I’m living Self Reliance, dude. If someone tries to kill me, I’m out. You already did, man. This is purgatory. And so, you gave him these, uh, ostrich farm tickets. – Yes. – And he never responded? No. And what was our final advice to you? Do you remember? It was, oh yeah, it was don’t say anything. – [Chris] Don’t bring it up. – [Jake] And, don’t ever do it again. And no gifts going forward. Yeah, you’re not a gifts guy. Yes. No. And if anything it’s a bottle of booze. – [Chris] Yes. Or, I think the advice was, or lean in. Or lean into it. And be the ostrich farm guy and give it to everybody. Everyone, or give it to him every year. Yes. So where are we at? Sure, so Link is one of the CEOs of the company, and one of the two hosts of the other show. Okay. So. Okay, so he has still never mentioned that you gave him the tickets. He did. So he came up to me right after. After we recorded. – [Chris] After we recorded, but before it released. Interesting. And he cornered me. Just outside of the kitchen here. Oh, keep going. Yeah, and he was like, yeah, and he said he was going to the area the next week. So he said he might drop by, and then I haven’t heard, and I’m not gonna ask. ((Laughing)) So he cornered you? Was it an aggressive cornering? You can be honest here. It was, it was a little bit, a little bit. He was looking for his lunch. And, I was. Why’s he cornering you if he’s looking for something to eat? Oh, you were in charge of his food. Yes, that day. He gives you a little bit of a hey, hey, hey, and then he goes, I got the ticket. He’s like, where’s lunch? Also, I got the tickets. Thank you. It was funny. He said it was funny. Okay. So, he saw it as a bit? Yes, he saw it as a bit, which is best case. Kind of best case. He didn’t fire me. He didn’t fire you. Also best case. Okay, amazing. And what are you going to do moving forward? No gifts, I think. You are leaning in with no gifts. Yeah, and I hope he doesn’t see this. ((Laughing)) I can tell you what, he’s not going to see this. He doesn’t watch the content, which is perfect for me. Yeah, yeah, okay, congrats, man. That’s a happy ending. Yeah, but thanks for the advice. Wonderful. ((Applause)) Cheers. I’m taking this with me. Cheers. – Alright. – Yeah, man, really fun. Good to see you again. Good to see you too. ((Laughing)) Great. Amazing. Amazing. Also, if you knew Link, like, not a terrible gift. For your third course. Oh, Nicole, you’re still here. ((Laughing)) We have otoro and ossetra caviar, please enjoy, gentlemen. – [Josh] Hell yeah. Great. That was, I mean, that was great timing. Delivery on her part. It was perfect. She’s killing it. – [Josh] That was good stuff. That was wild. So, he’s a perfect example of what’s really fun about the show. – [Josh] Yeah. And it’s, it’s the callers. And so you set up a premise and then you got funny people coming in and having fun. And that’s what’s been the, the most fun for us doing it. That’s something, man. What do you think of the Bud with it? You’re more of a food guy than me. This is pretty similar to Sapporo. It’s like a full bodied lager. Sapporo, I believe, is a Japanese lager. This definitely has the Budweiser aftertaste, that’s the only thing that makes this different. But if you have a Bud Light or a Miller Light, you can taste little differences if you go that route. A Budweiser, like for me, an Old South doesn’t have any of that taste. Yeah, growing up in Southern California, the IPA thing was like all the rage. – [Jake] Yeah. And so when you were like 16, 17, you would like have to start drinking. – [Jake Johnson] Tough start. Yeah, IPAs, because you already had to act like you were better than the light beer. And like, rough, rough upbringing on that. – [Jake] Oh, interesting. So the IPA thing had already blown up. It was, yeah, especially recently. Oh, there’s a show. Holy Jesus Christ. Unreal. Does this rival the sushi you had in Austin? It’s different. But it tasted like Coke, right? It tasted like Coke. – [Jake] I’m enjoying both experiences very much. – [Josh] Good, good, good. Alright, for your final course, we have uni from Hokkaido, some truffle shoyu, and bone marrow. Wow. – [Nicole] Enjoy. And why’d you decide to put the bone marrow on top? Cause I’m a little crazy. ((Laughing)) You’re a little crazy. I like it. Cool touch. That’s excellent. – [Nicole] Thank you. That was really phenomenal – [Jake] You really killed it. – [Nicole] Thanks. And I’ve never had a sushi set with pig tails and uh, the nails. Welcome to Mythical Kitchen, baby. Yeah, baby. ((Bells Ringing)) Jake, for your final course, we got the dregs of a can of Bud that’s up to about 85 degrees, and we got a vegan hot fudge sundae. – [Jake] Delicious. – [Josh] Why the hot fudge sundae? Similar Chicago diner style vibes? Yes, and it just feels like this is a classic, perfect dessert. What’s your favorite dessert? Holy shit. I’m a big ice cream guy, but I love like an ice cream cone, like a dipped cone. That’d probably be my favorite, I used to go to this place in the Poconos with my Nana, at her, at her lake house up there. – [Jake] Fun. They had all different kinds of dips. So if I ate all my vegetables as a kid, she’d take me there. Yeah, yeah. I’m not a huge dessert guy now, but I even see like from my kids, the big win is when they get a sweet and what the sweet is, and this to me was the home run as a kid. – [Josh] Yeah. I want to talk about your relationship with your dad. – [Jake] Yeah. One of the most fascinating stories you’ve told is when he left when you were about two and a half, came back into your life when you were about seventeen, or? Yes. And he was an alcoholic. Yep. You said you used to operate a lot out of pure spite, and when he wanted to meet you, you would drink his favorite drink in front of him at a bar as a condition of talking to you. Well, I would always drink his Stolis, and I would want to smoke Merits in front of him. What I thought at the time was I was just doing it because, screw you two. Yeah. All of a sudden, he’s now sober and in AA, and the whole world’s supposed to change, and we’re all supposed to be like, so proud of you. And, I just wasn’t. I was like, no you can’t skip out essentially from 2 to 17 and then have a good six months and have everybody be like, wow, you’re so brave. Absolution ain’t that easy. – [Jake] I was like, yeah, pass. I realized as I got older, I was like, oh, I was testing him, because, and this is when you told me your dad passed at 19. I said like, what a brutal age. Yeah. Because you still have so much want for your parents. So even at 40, I think my dad died when I was 44. I’m still like, nah, too soon. And I have to be like, I’m 44 buddy. He was 80 almost. But you go like, oh that relationship you never wanted to end. Cause there’s like more you can kind of gleam. And I think for me, I wanted so much of him. And when he wasn’t around, when he came back, I just wasn’t willing to say like, great, I trust you. – [Josh] Sure. I was like, no, it’s too vulnerable. There’s too much want. So, I’m going to try to push you away and back to drinking so that I’m able to say, see? – [Josh] Yeah. And then when he didn’t after a while, I was like, I’m the piece of shit. Yeah, you wanted to lose. You wanted to lose that relationship. And I wanted him to admit that this AA and this new change was fake. And the real him was the guy who didn’t raise me because that would have been easier. And then when I realized, oh, it’s actually he had an addiction and a disease, the real him would have been so great all those years. That was the big turn, and then I finally allowed that kind of in. When my kids came. And then we just had, you know, a blast. Do you think it’s just this general paradox that when you are young enough to nurture those relationships in their prime, you are too stupid to know how to do it, if that makes sense? When you’re young enough to nurture. Okay. So like, uh, I also grew up, I was super spiteful towards my dad. You know, he was very lonely. He was, he would just kinda like propose to random women in mall food courts, you know?. How did he pass? Went in for surgery when he was 64, supposed to be relatively low risk and just didn’t come off the operating table. But, but, at that time he’d like found a new love and my stepmom was incredible, and so he had like one great year with her and one year where he started to heal, but. But when you were growing up he was in and out, he wasn’t really great, he wasn’t giving you what you needed. Exactly, exactly, and I always held that against him and then the minute he died it was just this huge crush of like, oh how stupid and so fast. Did you feel that even at 44? Because we had so many good years. – [Josh] Yeah? That I was able to do a lot more of that kind of healing. But what I did have was there was a deep part of me that still hated him deep down. And he knew it too. Sure, we were very close and I would always say like, I love you, come on. And he’d be like, but you don’t. And I’m like, I do, I do, stop it, I’m just not, I’m different. You know, I don’t want to look in your eyes and tell you how much I love you. It’s just not this vibe. But deep down, we both knew I was still holding on to a little bit of that anger. And that’s what vanished when he died. I ain’t got kids yet. You got kids. You have two twin daughters. How does your relationship with your dad specifically inform the way that you parent? Well, I think it’s tricky. So it’s hard. My dad was a great parent to an adult. And that matters because parenting jobs don’t really stop. And that’s the kind of crazy thing when you get into it. But in terms of growing up, I can’t look to him a lot. I was raised by a single mom. And I grew up believing my mom was my mom and my dad. So I would even say it, like if another kid said like, you don’t have a dad, I would say, yeah I do, it’s my mom. And you go. Yeah. But my mom was both. You know, she was tough when she needed to be, she was soft when she needed to be. So I lean on what my mom did. I guess the big thing for me is I don’t want to blow these years. – [Josh] Yeah. Damon, who, had kids before, said a really funny thing during that year when I was really panicking because they were coming and he said, No matter how hard you try, your kids are going to find something to hate you for. Sure. And I was like, they’re not going to hate me for not being around. They can hate me for my personality. That’s fine. ((Laughing)) Yeah, generally unlikable. I get it. You can hate me for me. Fair. But you’re going to know my ass. I don’t like me most times. – [Jake] Hate that. But it’s not gonna be like, I didn’t know him, you’re gonna know me. You don’t have to like me, but you are gonna know me. In tradition on the show, we gotta ask you, what do you think happens when you die? I had a thing with my dad, going back to end on this, and we were having a talk about ghosts and all this. And he was like, how the [BLEEP] should I know? And then he goes, well here’s the thing, I’m probably gonna die before you, so let’s make a deal. And I was like, what’s the deal? And he goes, and this was before I had gotten on TV and had any kind of power. And he said, When I die, I want to be burned. Take my ashes, break into Wrigley Field, go on, true story, go on the right side of home base, as if I was a righty, scatter my ashes there, and if there’s any way I will come at that moment. So, I always thought, like, what a clear, like, scientific way of doing it. Like, I’ll break into a stadium in the middle of the night. I have no problem for this, for sure. Then all I gotta do is get his ashes, put it there as if he’s a righty, and wait. Well, then I get on TV, things start happening, blah, blah, blah. I get asked to do, to throw out the first pitch at Wrigley Field. Last summer. So, we’ve been saving his ashes for it. So, we get to Wrigley. And I’m sitting there, and I got, you know, you get a jersey when you do that, and they put your last name on. I put his name, Crocco, and then I put, he used to live, we all used to live at, visit and hang out at his house called, in Chicago, and it was 425. That was his address. And it was called the 425 Club, we all loved it. So I put 425 on it. I throw out the first pitch and then you go and you shake hands with like the catcher, mascot thing or whatever. And so I walked over and when I did it, I then shook, went really quickly, I had his ashes in my pocket, put him down on home plate, rubbed the ground, took a second and looked up. And I didn’t feel anything. So, what that means, I don’t know. Sure. But, I really wanted, if there was gonna be something, I wanted that moment to feel like, Oh! And it was a beautiful moment. It was great, but I didn’t have any answers, so what I really feel is when you die, I don’t know yet. The Cubs are either going to win the World Series very soon, or you’ve cursed them for another hundred years with those ashes, so we’ll see what happens. What’s funny about it, what we didn’t realize, is my brother and I do a really, in bad form joke, but we, everyone of my family does my dad’s voice. – [Josh] Yeah. But we didn’t realize is they do a lot of concerts there. So I’ll leave messages for my brother and be like, this is a nightmare. There’s a band, I don’t even know who this is. This kid’s screaming, it’s midnight. I hate it here. You ready to get in the lightning round? Yes. – [Josh] Let’s do it, man. Other than me, who’s the one person, dead or alive, you’d want to share your actual last meal with? Probably my brother. Who’s the greatest sitcom character of all time? Sam Malone. What song do you want to be played at your funeral? You know, I just heard this bit on the, uh, uh, Heavyweight podcast, where they were talking about this, and the woman, as a joke said, the song from the, Six Flags. Dun dun dun dun dun dun. Dun dun dun dun dun. So maybe that. – [Josh] Be a vibe. Yeah. Who do the Bears take with the number one overall pick? So I would probably say, if it were up to me, it depends if we win out. Or at least win three of the next four. I think Justin Fields is a winner. I’m liking what he’s doing. I would maybe say trade it, and get a lot of draft capital. Stack capital. Build the trenches. But I also like this other idea that I heard, that you get a rookie contract for a quarterback, and then you can pay everybody else for the next five years. What’s your biggest fear? Being locked in a box. Most people say stuff like, failure. But no, being locked in a box is way scarier. You fail all the time. Failure’s fine. How often are you getting locked in a box? Look, if someone’s like, not having my dreams come true, fine, form another dream. Being locked in a box? – [Josh] Oh my God, yeah. You can’t get out of a box? No, quicksand, that’s scary. Yeah, quicksand is 100 percent scarier than like, you know, failure. I grew up thinking that one day I would be captured and tortured. I did too. Why was that? Well, I saw Platoon too young. Okay. So I was really, I saw that and I saw Deer Hunter. I saw Deer Hunter too, that explains it. So Deer Hunter, those scenes, when he’s in that little, when I say box, what I really mean is a bamboo cage in water up to here with rats. Yes. I watched Deliverance when I was like seven. Yes. So that, I mean. This explains a lot about us. Which stunt with Tom Cruise do you feel like you were most gonna die in? We had to run around this entire building while we were being shot at. And Tom likes everything in a two shot. So, it was legit, like, you know, a city block on a roof, running and jumping over stuff. And we got there that morning and we were walking through it and he said like, just keep up with me, camera’s gonna be in front of us. And I go like, alright. And I thought they were doing a bit, cause he does a lot of jokes. And I was like, yeah. And then I went like, alright. Where are the nets? ((Laughing)) And the, stunt coordinator goes, what are you talking about? And I go, the nets? If I fall off the goddamn building, where are the net that catches me? And he goes, how could we have nets? We’re filming it. You would see the nets. And I went like, and I go like, huh. And then I go to Tom. Well, if we fall off, we can die. And he literally said, well, don’t fall off. And I was like, by no means am I planning to fall off when I’m chasing you, you maniac! And that was one where I was like, I, and I don’t know how to get out of it. If I said like, honest to God, I don’t feel comfortable. I think I’m still doing it. Yeah, uh huh. So I was like, I think I just have to do this. Oh God. Finally, are you, are you happy? Yeah, I think so. Yeah, it’s close enough. It’s a nice phase. Jake, thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you. ((Laughing)) Ooh, he’s furry. If you will look at that camera right there and deliver your last words. Please check out Self Reliance and, We’re Here to Help anywhere you can find your podcasts. As you can see, you’ve helped so many people, including Chris. He seemed, he was shaking. He was shaking. He was shaking a little bit. He was shaking. But he was shaking with good advice. It was like the spirit was flowing through him. It was a pleasure to meet him. – [Josh] You’re too hot to handle and so is your bakeware. Get a Mythical Kitchen oven mitt available now at Mythical.com